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Summary:
Is your business communicating the right messaging? How does a well branded business benefit you? Design and branding are all about communicating the personality of your business. Kaila Piepkow, owner of Dox Design, gives us a crash course in design and branding. She shares how we need to get out of our own way and connect better with our ideal clients. She shares why, as pet professionals, design and design language are so important. We dive into the role of color theory in eliciting the right emotions, and how our businesses are judged by the brand. Kaila discusses the importance of editing, and how white space helps enhance the vibe and other elements in our business.
Topics on this episode:
Designing to communicate
Design vs branding
What’s working?
Design language we can use
Main take away: A brand is more than a logo, and should connect not just with your clients, but have your personality in it as well.
About our guest:
Kaila is the crazy dog-lady, creative director, and designer behind Dox Design; a remote design studio that helps pet professionals become top dogs through branding and packaging design. Not only is she a proud fur-mama to three dachshunds and a lover of any 70s music (but especially The Beatles) she is also a passionate advocate for #droolworthy brands for small businesses.
After taking her first few years out of college in the traditional agency route, like many entrepreneurs she felt restless… like her cup wasn’t being filled to the top. So she had a vision, to take her two favorite things—dogs and design—and create something that nobody had done before. Something big, bold, and most importantly, drool-worthy. And so, Dox Design was born!
Today, Kaila is the proud leader to her fearless team on a mission to create strong, compelling brands that flaunt our clients’ stand-out qualities in fun and daring ways. Together, Dox Design works seamlessly to create #droolworthy brands and design for people just like you: the doers, the dreamers and the dog-obsessed.
Links:
On Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dox.designstudio
On Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dox.design/
Join her Facebook group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/designforsmallbusinesses/
Check out their website: https://dox.design
Give us a call! (636) 364-8260
Follow us on: Instagram, Facebook, Twitter
Subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, Google, Stitcher, & TuneIn
Email us at: feedback@petsitterconfessional.com
A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE
Provided by otter.ai
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
brand, clients, design, people, pet, communicate, dog, colors, business, important, work, designer, image, branding, logo, gift, put, fonts, typography, post
SPEAKERS
Collin Funkhouser, Kaila
Collin Funkhouser 00:17
Hi, I'm Megan. I'm Collin. And this is pet sitter confessional, and open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter brought to you by town, pet and pet perennials. How would you describe your brand? Is it communicating effectively to the clients that you want to be getting? killer Petco, owner of dogs design joins the show to talk about the difference between design and brand. We discuss what it means to be consistent with our branding across all of the avenues that we do and how we are supposed to be communicating effectively through our logo through our colors through our fonts, all of that in so much more. Let's get started.
Kaila 01:00
Thank you so much for having me. Well, as you mentioned, I am the owner and creative director of Doc's design. We are a remote design studio that specializes in branding, design and packaging design in our niche is the pet industry. So by day, I am a designer leading my team as the creative director. And by night I am a dog mom to three very sassy dioxins that keep me very busy. Which is kind of how I got into the pet space being a dog, mom. And yeah, design is just a huge passion of mine. What I've always known I wanted to do, and I'm really happy that I'm able to kind of serve other dog obsessed people like myself, and kind of bring that zone of genius to the pet industry. Yeah.
Collin Funkhouser 01:45
How did you find yourself getting into design? So you said it was something that you've always been passionate about? What's your been your journey into that?
Kaila 01:54
Yeah, so I've always been artistic. I was never the sports type, like at all, like all my siblings were like, super sporty, my parents were they always really tried to push me into basketball. But I was always like the art kid. So I always knew that like arch was what I wanted to do. But I didn't want to quite be a starving artist. So was trying to figure out how we can make that a career path. And it actually was my high school yearbook class, where I started getting introduced into some of the Adobe programs and actually learning like layout design, you know, color theory, typography, kind of all the fundamentals of design that I didn't really know at the time, were actually designed and I kind of just had a natural knack for it being an artistic and creative person. And my teacher saw that in me and she had kind of mentioned, you know, graphic design is kind of like this new ish field. with computers, you should look into it. And so from then on out, I was kind of like, Okay, I'm going to be a designer, I have the natural talent for it. And it was something that I actually enjoyed doing. So I went to school, I have my BFA in graphic design. And from there, I was able to kind of do the traditional agency route, which is what I always thought I wanted to do my like game plan was okay, I'm going to work in like these top design agencies, I'm going to do all the grunt work, I'm going to work myself a creative director, like I'm going to be living in New York, like that was kind of always the game plan. And then I think like many entrepreneurs, as soon as I got into, like the office, the first year out of college, I'm like, wow, this is life. And I am not loving it. Just the office environment was not for me, like, I don't thrive in that sort of environment. And I had just gotten my first dog Finley, who's our first doxon. And I just hated leaving her alone every day, like just having her see those puppy dog eyes. I was like, I know, this is not the kind of lifestyle I want. So very quickly, I was like, Okay, I don't want to work in an agency. So what can I do. And from there, I started kind of freelancing on the side just as like a creative outlet. And also just to like, kind of pick up some extra money. And I quickly realized that I could take all of my knowledge from working in an agency setting and kind of bring it to smaller businesses that are often overlooked by these big agencies. And like I said, I'm a dog Mom, I have three dogs, and I was very, like, ingrained in the dog community where I lived like I had my pet store and like my vet and my groomer and my dog walker and like went to the dog park with other dog moms. And that kind of just was a natural fit for me. And that's kind of how I came up with the idea of dogs design and niching down in the pet industry.
Collin Funkhouser 04:41
That's awesome. I love how you able to overlay your your passions for for both of those things, design and for the pet care as you worked your way down in niching down into the pet care space. What are some of the unique challenges of design for the pet care that you see as you interact with business owners
Kaila 05:00
Oh, yes, this is a good one. So I think a personal challenge for our business is something that's really important for us, it's just making sure that we don't really like to say we have a style, because it's really important when we're designing for a brand that we're designing for the business and designing for their target audience and not just like what's trendy or like what we think is fun and want to do. So I think a personal challenge is I think a lot of clients will come to us with something they've seen on Pinterest, or something that's like, super trendy at the time and want to do that. And it's like our job to educate that when you are designing in that way. That is when your brand quickly goes out of style, it might not be resonating with your audience, and that you kind of have to flip it on its head and say, you know, we're designing to communicate at the end of the day, that's what your brand is. And we want to make sure we're communicating the right thing, not just what's trendy at the time. So I think that is one thing, not even just in the pet industry, just in general, being able to educate our clients that come in, specifically in the pet industry. For our team, I think it gets a little bit difficult, like how many different ways can we illustrate a dog? But you know, we manage, we always we always get the brand looking nice and unique for every single thing. But you know, I'm like, No, no more pause, we're not doing pause. So you know, kind of coming up with a few more. I guess I like to say like metaphors for like the pet industry that isn't just like putting the paw in the logo, like coming up with creative ways that we can kind of showcase pets without it being so literal. It's just a creative challenge, I think for our team, you know, to get it out of that mind space, and really kind of give our clients the best work we can.
Collin Funkhouser 06:41
Yeah. And you mentioned, you know, you're designing to communicate, and a lot of business owners can really struggle with that of trying to figure out, I think a What are they trying to communicate like? How do you work through? How do you work with a business owner to get at that level? And go know, what is your business actually about? Yeah, so
Kaila 07:02
we cannot have like this little Venn diagram, exercise we do internally. And it's kind of hard to pull, pull the information out of our clients, it's a lot of soul searching our signature branding program, like it's a lot of like deep questions we asked you, but kind of like the one side is audience. So that is the most important, obviously, you are targeting a certain type of pet parent. And that certain type of pet parent will be attracted to certain visuals before they will even read the words on your advertising. So I always like to say like, the two examples I always use is like, okay, you have like the suburban dog mom who like is all about family and cover. And then you have like, the big like pet parrot who lives in the city and like is a single pet parent living in a high rise, those are true, like very different audiences and like, the way you're gonna communicate to them is very different. So first, you have to kind of start to think about who your ideal audience is. and dig a little bit deeper than just saying pet parrot and actually start to think about like, who they are as a person, and maybe some of the other brands outside of the pet world that they interact with. And that resonates with them, that starts to help, you know, get that image of who that person is. Then on the flip side of that just as important as who you are as a brand, like what your brand values are, I kind of use the word brand vibe or brand tone, you obviously want to attract your type of people. And like at the end of the day, what is that for your business? I think this is the part where you kind of said it gets hard for clients to kind of drill down to that. We help a little bit with that, you know, we'll get a lot of general words like fun, comfort, things like that. It's like okay, but what do you do specifically in your business that gives some comfort and then you know, we start digging a little deeper, and we will get like, oh, like our client, or like our team is on call 24. Seven, like, we're always texting, like we attend our dog's birthday party, like they'll, you know, they'll start to give us little stories or like little testimonials and stuff like that, that their clients have said about them. And I'm like, Okay, let's that makes you unique. Like that is what we're gonna focus on for your brand.
Collin Funkhouser 09:09
I'm sure that's hard. Sometimes I know, it is for me, as the business owner to separate us and also to separate my design aesthetic of like, things that I like versus what, what my clients are going to like, how do you how do you, as a business owner, know when to make that decision of like, Well, I know I like this. But is that my target audience? Because you know, there's some times where if you're looking at a design, you may go, Oh, I can't stand that. But I guess my clients like it like,
Kaila 09:38
yeah, that's definitely difficult. I mean, I struggle with that, even with like with my own brand. I think anyone who owns a business, it is such a personal thing. Like my business is my baby, as I'm sure your business is your baby. So it's really hard to kind of step out of that, like get out of your own way, which is when like hiring someone or just having like outside eyes can really help with that. But I do think Alex Some level some base level your business is who you are like you started your business and started tracking that certain people. Because you might not know it, but maybe it's because of the way you talk. Maybe it's the language you use, like maybe it's your training method, like maybe it's just like you've been super personable. Like, there is a reason why. So I like to kind of, you know, turn to your audience for that, especially if you have clients that have been clients for a long time, maybe like, ask them like, Okay, what was it initially that wanted you to work with me? And if they're like, oh, you're just so friendly. You're so warm, you're so comforting. It's like, okay, okay, I keep hearing these words over and over again, for my audience. Now, how can I visually communicate this to them? before they even get to know me, because of those couple of clients that have been with you from the beginning, like I'm sure they like knew you at first, or they got to know you before they started getting really invested. And with branding, you're wanting to communicate that was in three seconds. So being able to kind of figure out what it was that drawn your clients to you. And then being able to like, echo that back in a way is really what the brand starts to be successful. I
Collin Funkhouser 11:08
love that way that you put it of like your clients are attracted to you for a reason. So how do you how do you communicate you to other people who don't know you already or have an existing relationship?
Kaila 11:19
Yeah, it's kind of like a mind meld of the two little Star Trek references. We have any Star Trek friend. But it's kind of like a mind meld of the two. I think a lot of people get really hung up on the deliverables, like though like, like, can't get out of the way when it comes to like picking colors, because I like blue, blue. I like blue. Because my clients like blue, it's like, every visual decision you're making has like a deeper meaning to it. So sometimes when you like, flip it on its head and think about it in a different way of like, Okay, I'm not just talking about blue, I'm talking about like color evokes emotions, what kind of emotion Am I trying to give out? You know, when you start thinking about that way, I think it becomes a little easier to get out of your own way, and to make some visual decisions that just aren't based on personal preference. But like I said, a lot of the times the to do overlap, just because naturally, being a small business owner, you are like a huge part of your business.
Collin Funkhouser 12:08
Well, and you touched on there of how I feel like some of that can be very overwhelming going through that process. Like if you've ever pulled up the hex codes of colors and just kind of ticked over 1111 and seen just the huge variability and gone, well, I don't I don't know, like what this is gonna do for me. And what you're kind of saying here is just like, no, like, take a step back, breathe, and really start thinking about the clients and these connections that we can emotions to that you can start evoking with these elements that we're putting into this process.
Kaila 12:42
Yeah, I think the biggest thing I see when people are trying to DIY their brand is they obviously get really excited and want to get right into those deliverables like the colors but like you said, if you're just kind of going to the deep end right away with no sort of foundation, it does become very overwhelming. But when you do some of that groundwork beforehand, like I was just saying with audience tone and stuff like that it really helps guide those visual decisions and makes them a little less overwhelming.
13:11
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Collin Funkhouser 13:33
If you are looking for new petsitting software for your business, give time to pet a try. As a listener of pet sitter confessional, you'll get 50% off your first three months when you sign up at time to pet.com slash confessional. We've used a few terms here back and forth here of design in brand. And so I'd love to get your perspective on what the difference is between those when we're thinking of it in a in a business context.
Kaila 14:01
Yeah, so I would say design is like the vessel for the brand. So the brand is not just the visuals, visuals is one piece of it. And that's like the piece that our team focuses on. But your brand is also the language you use, like your tone of voice, your copywriting, your values, your pillars like your giveback programs, your brand is really like your personality of your business. And then the design is like the clothes you're wearing to kind of put it in a metaphor. So like when you look at someone, you can kind of probably make a pretty good judgment on their personality based on what they're wearing. And you know, they're maybe trying to communicate something through their style, which that's what design is to your business. You're trying to communicate a certain aesthetic, you're trying to communicate a certain ceiling. But then when you also talk to that person and get to know them the way they're talking. The language they're using maybe their body movements, just like the way they're interacting, you also start to draw conclusions about that. And then that's like the full person would be the brands kind of put it in a metaphor. So yeah, does that make sense? It does it does. I
Collin Funkhouser 15:14
think you use a word earlier that I really liked was kind of the vibe, what kind of vibe Do you get off? Yeah, give off that. And I think that's something that we can all connect with of like, just visually seeing something we start, you know, it's as terrible as it is, a lot of times that vibe, we start making assumptions about what that means and what they stand for, and all this stuff in. And that's, I think, what you're saying, Here is why that design language is so important, because people will be looking and will be making assumptions. But are they the right assumptions about who you are? And what your business is?
Kaila 15:43
Exactly? They definitely Yeah, I always tell my team, you, US designers, we definitely judge a book by its cover, like, Don't judge a book by its cover. But people do they judge you they judge your business by their brand. And they it's, like I said, it takes three seconds for them to make assumptions about your brand, just based on some of these visual cues you're giving them? Yeah, especially now in today's age, I think I'm also just seeing like the pet industry is starting to take it more seriously. And watching a lot of these brands who have done the work upfront grow a little bit faster than those who haven't. So it's definitely important,
Collin Funkhouser 16:20
right? And as you know, you said like, well, that's the whole point of doing a design and having a brand is that you're you're trying to make people make the proper assumptions like in that you're trying to communicate that as effectively as you can. And so when we thinking about design, how does a good design a good branding? How does that make our business better?
Kaila 16:43
Ooh, yeah, that's a good question. I think if your brand is 100%, successful, you kind of just hit that on the nail on the head there that it's giving your customers who you are, just by looking like, say at a billboard without even reading it. Based on the fonts you have, based on the colors you have, based on the imagery you're using. I mean, you're seeing all that before you're even reading the billboard before you're even reading the social media ad. So when you are able to accurately communicate what you're trying to do before they even read words, that is when a design is really successful, a brand is really successful. And I kind of just touched on what some of those parts and pieces are, there's definitely a lot more of them. But you know, taking typography into consideration your color palette, the images, you're using the textures, patterns, breadth elements, all that stuff, working together in unison, to give that message across very quickly is when the design is successful for the brain. Yeah,
Collin Funkhouser 17:43
and you just laid out a lot of pieces there of texture and typography. you've ever gone to the website, a website just looked at typography, like you will go crazy in a mere matter of seconds, trying to figure out what you know, which one does that one evoke the right emotions. But again, I think just backing way up and taking this big, holistic approach and, and really slowing down in that process. And, and, and putting in that thought and effort and, you know, partnering with somebody if that's what you have to do, but not really putting the cart before the horse, right? Because a lot of us do get run down into the deep end, and go well, I don't know if I like Arial. Or if I like Times New Roman, or if I like, you know, Rio garamond or whatever, and figuring out those those kinds of Yeah, well,
Kaila 18:27
you know, I also tell my clients who are always somewhat on the fence with like hiring a professional or whatever it's like, at the end of the day, like, are you going to sit there and try to learn how to do taxes? Are you gonna hire an accountant, like, at the end of the day, your time is more valuable? I mean, designers, especially professionals, like they, like our team all has degrees in design. And I think between the four of us, we've taken like 13 typography classes, like there's a reason like we're able to pick that stuff so quickly. It's because that's what we live in breathe every day. So I'm like, don't get frustrated, it's okay that you can't figure this out in two seconds. Like, I'm not an accountant, I can't figure out my taxes in two seconds, you know, so I think everyone gets, like you said, they get on the deep end, they get frustrated really quickly, when it's just because, you know, it takes experience, but also it takes that more holistic approach to it and not getting so caught up in the details and getting overwhelmed, right,
Collin Funkhouser 19:19
because the devil is in the details. And you can go way off, you know, into areas and like you said, like you as the business owner, like we have to recognize where our strengths and where our weaknesses are, and invest appropriately in both time and in money. It's to make things happen, right? And so like many people go look at a design and I think it design and and like dance and sports and other athletic stuff. Like the people who make it look really easy are the ones that do it making it working the hardest. And so you can look at a design and go, well that's not hard, like I can do that. But then you sit down and try and take on all these elements into account and you can get way in over your head and then never actually make something out of it. So recognize where the strengths and weaknesses are as the business owner, and then you know, be okay, handing it off and helping that process. Yes, definitely. So for you and your team, when you're when you're working through this process when you're making a design, and you're doing a rebrand of somebody, how do you know when it's done? How do you know whenever you put the stamp of approval on it on it and is ready to ship? Oh,
Kaila 20:25
that's such a good question. So we have like a pretty set formula that we use for our brands. And we kind of have like a checklist of like the parts and pieces, we call it, the visual toolkit, that's kind of what we've coined. So for us, it's really important not to just give a client a branded be like by sia and like, not have them have any idea how to use it. So for us, we think of our visual brand that we give them as, like I said, a toolkit, we give you the tools to be able to successfully implement it on your own and keep growing it and keep, you know, refreshing it. So in some sense, a brand is never really done. It's always growing, it's always evolving. But when we know a brand is done, and we are ready to hand it off is when all of those toolkit pieces are met. So I kind of touched on some of them already, obviously logo, important part, that's always the thing that people are coming to us asking for. But they don't realize that a brand is more than the logo, we say it all the time. But you know, it's all these other pieces. So the logo is definitely a piece of it. But brand colors, which I think is just as if not more important. The brand typography, image style. So like what type of images are you posting on social media, like, what is the overall vibe of that. And then we have what we call brand elements. So with that, we do an icon, illustration set for clients to kind of give them an illustration or icon style. And then we'll do a berean pattern. And then just like little kind of designer touches of other little illustration elements. So once we're able to knock all of that out, and our process is very collaborative with our clients. So you know, before we even get to that point, we're already on the same page of like what we're going to be doing. But once we're able to kind of give that all to them get the stamp of approval from the client, we're able to export all those tools laid out in the document for them to be able to implement on their own. And that's kind of one of the stamp of approval of Okay, this brand, framework and brand is john for them to use. Now, like I said, to some sense, a brand is always growing and evolving. I mean, we have clients that are part of our design lab, which is how we support clients on an ongoing basis that come back each quarter. And maybe they need new illustrations because they're launching a holiday line, or maybe they're launching a new product. And they need a few new colors for like the different flavors of the label. So at some sense, a brand is always growing. But that foundation and that toolkit we create is so strong that it it's very easy to build on top of that, and still have things look on brand.
Collin Funkhouser 23:00
Yeah, and I love how you say that brand is always going to be in constant flux, because there's the things that we're trying to communicate about our brand. And then there's the meaning that we are imbuing into our brand, right, like, one of the things that I think about a lot is the Nike swoosh, right? Like it inherently doesn't mean anything. It we know, it means something because Nike has told us that it means something and it represents this stuff. So there's this, there's this larger picture that we as the business get to do, right, we get to take this and then help that communicate better to our clients through how we use it. The you know, you touched on the image style of, you know, grant of images that we're using, and it just becomes this big holistic approach to communicating and giving meaning to this stuff that we are creating and using.
Kaila 23:49
Yeah, and that's what our brand is, I mean, if you keep it consistent, that you really stick to that and keep it going. That's when brands are really successful and could do some really fun and cool stuff. Like you said, the Nike swoosh is so iconic, they don't even have to have the words Nike next to it anymore. So you know, you can really start to grow your brand. And that way where it's so instantly recognizable just by like the colors and the the images and everything like that. And that is when a brand really kind of has its own. I think
Collin Funkhouser 24:16
you touched on being consistent with branding. And I know that it's something that a lot of people really struggle with of making, they get their color setups, and they get these textures, they get these elements, get some image guidance. And then four months down the road, the wheels have fallen off the cart, and they're looking up going, what on earth am I doing? So how do how do we keep our branding consistent with all the posts that we're having to do with all of the images that we're having to create over time?
Kaila 24:44
Yes, so I am a huge proponent of Canva. Now don't get me wrong, I think Canva has its time in place. I don't think you should be designing your logo in Canva. But to keep your brand in order, Canvas great. They have a whole section called up Have a brand kit where you can put in your brand colors, put in your brand fonts, put in your brand logos, you can even create, like a team for your brand have different templates that will automatically change out the colors and the fonts to match. It's just like a really nice system that isn't super expensive. And it's super accessible. It's not like Adobe ready to learn. It's not a huge learning curve. And you know, it's a good tool for those who are trying to DIY it themselves. And everything is right there and consistent for you. I think just having a central location like that, I think I see where people start to like spin and the wheels fall off is where it's like not written down anywhere, or like they know their colors. But they're kind of guessing every time I think even just like setting up that brand kit is insanely helpful because it will be the exact shade of blue every single time, it will be the exact font you're using every single time and you can get really, really deep with it or even just having colors and fonts, I think is like a really great first step,
Collin Funkhouser 25:57
when it comes to assessing our current design language, our current brand, what are some signs that it needs changing? And that it might not necessarily be as working as effectively as we need it to?
Kaila 26:10
Yeah, so that's a good question. I so there's like a rule in interior design. It's like the 10 year rule where every 10 years, you're supposed to refresh your interiors, because things are probably out of trend. Or just innately You know, every couple years things go. So I like to kind of use that rule of thumb for brand as well, maybe even five years, I'm just kind of reassessing and being like, okay, is this dated? Like, clearly we've advanced technology wise, like maybe my client base has grown, like the trends of dogs have changed? I mean, ideally, like, if you could do an audit, even every year, that would be great. But in terms of like actually changing or refreshing, I'd say like the five to 10 year mark. But in terms of like, when is it not working anymore? That's such a good question. Because I don't really have a direct answer for that. And I would say that I would lean on my audience for that, um, you know, if you're starting to see a drop off, if you're just starting to see that, like your engagements down or something isn't resonating something that's that clicking, you know, don't be afraid to ask your audience, you know, like, Hey, guys, or you know, do a little bit of market research, maybe run two different ads with two different colors to different sort of images, which one gets the most engagement and gets the most type of people to your event, or gets booking the 10 people that you want, you know, doing some stuff like that will really help kind of be like, okay, like, maybe it's because I'm like an all black and white brand. And like I'm trying to, like get millennials in. And clearly they're not resonating with that. And it's like too Stark for them. You know, there's a lot of variables that play of like what it could be, but I definitely think leaning on your audience and like just kind of doing some of that research is super helpful, instead of just guessing and being like, well, is that the colors? This is the fire? No, I'm gonna be in camera and kind of just messing around like educated decisions are good decisions.
28:03
Well, you mentioned an audit there. So what does a brand audit consist of?
Kaila 28:09
Oh, that's good. So I, when I'm doing an audit of a brand, we break it down, because we are focused on just the visuals. So I guess I will give you from a visual side of things. We break it down using that formula that I just talked about. So you know, I will go through and I'll be like, Okay, do they have a logo? Yes. Do they have multiple versions of the logo? Or do they just have one logo that they're using on everything? Oh, they only have one logo? Okay, is the logo super horizontal? And like really hard to get in a vertical format? Yes. Okay. So they need multiple logos? And is the logo currently communicating what they do as a business in a successful way? Is it currently you know, they told me that their audience was this, but I'm seeing that like, on their Instagram, the majority of people who are following them, or this, you know, kind of going down like this, then we move on to the colors. Do they have a brand color palette? Yes. No? Is it consistent? Yes, no, how many colors are in the palette, you know, just kind of going down the list like that. Brand fonts. And then usually, I would say like 80% of the brands that come to us really only have those three pieces, they don't really have the brand illustration, pattern, textures, like all that stuff to begin with, um, you know, they'll, I can see a lot of times when clients are like using camera or something like that there's certain elements they're gravitating towards, or like using again and again, so they're kind of doing it without me realize that they're doing it, and then I'm able to kind of, you know, communicate back to them like, Okay, well I see in Canva that you're using like a lot of florals and that you like keep using this template. Like is there a reason for that? Oh, I was trying to communicate that like our dog treats are all natural ingredients that I really wanted. I'm like, Okay, okay, let's dive a little deeper there. You know, so I feel like people don't give themselves enough credit. Like if you look at what you're doing, there's probably a reason you're doing it. And if you just made me think a little bit more on that and then start auditing yourself and being like, what pieces are missing, and like, if I'm already doing stuff that I don't really know I'm doing Why am I doing that? And can I do that in a more strategic way where it's not kind of just like willy nilly? Like, can I double down on that
Collin Funkhouser 30:11
wanted to touch on images for a little bit in the role both play in our brands? Because I among all of the other stuff that goes into design language and branding, I think images can really confuse us. Because Isn't it just an image, right? Like, how do I how do I bring my brand into an image that I'm posting on social media?
Kaila 30:33
Yeah, no, it is not just an image. I mean, at the end of the day, there is like, certain, like, if you're posting an image of a client, like I tell my clients don't like overcomplicate it, like, if it's a picture of a happy dog you're walking, you can post it like it's okay. You don't have to like, overcomplicate it, I think where the imagery comes into play is like in the advertisements side of things. So, if you are doing a billboard, if you're running an ad, in a newspaper, if you're running a social media ad, like if you have an about postcard you're giving out, you know, those sort of touch points that are more branded and represent the brand. I think that is where the imagery is a little bit more important. I'm personally not a huge proponent of like an overly done Instagram feed, I like it a little bit more organic and not so planned. But when it comes to like those branded pieces, that imagery that you're picking, yeah, absolutely makes a difference. If you are in an urban setting, and you are primarily targeting like single millennial pet parents, like you're not gonna want like a picture of a dog running on a farm, like, you know, just like stuff like that is like just having like a more like, lifestyle photography with like a cityscape in the back and start to like, have someone imagine like, oh, like I live in that area, like that's like kind of, you know, familiar to me, like this image is resonating with me. Or on the flip side of that, like, if you are trying to communicate like no, like we're we do pack walks, we're like an outdoorsy like hiking brand. Like having the dogs out in nature, like being playful with it nice, soft lighting, you know, stuff like that is really important, not just like grabbing the first, like, overly posed photo you see on ISOC that's like, on a white background, because that's not really gonna do it for anyone, you know,
Collin Funkhouser 32:15
right? In a you know, I love how you touch there. It's the it's the content of the photo, because I know my mind goes immediately to well, you know, I know, I don't know, if I'm gonna be able to get my brand colors in this photo every single time.
Kaila 32:28
I mean, bonus point, Bonus points if you can, like I've seen a few of my clients who like buy, like their brand color leashes and bandanas and we'll do a photoshoot like, that's awesome. Like, the more you can do that and put the special touches, the better. But like if you're just starting, like start with content, that's a pretty easy one to narrow it down. I think
Collin Funkhouser 32:47
thinking about design. I know many, many listeners don't have a background in design. So I'm not entirely sure how to ask this, but maybe give us some some design language that we can use to talk about design more effectively when we're trying to communicate what we're working with and what we want. Ooh, okay, this is so good. I
Kaila 33:12
have so many, um, I think two big ones that are like design like terms that not a lot of people know. And you know, because everyone at some level knows, like color fonts, everything like that. But I think where I see a lot of people they start getting frustrated is like they have all that and then they go to start to lay something out. And it doesn't look like how it would look if a designer did it. And they're like, Okay, I have my colors, I have my fonts, I have the image like why isn't it looking like the way it's supposed to be looking. And so two of the things that designers do, and that is like design terms, the first one is called hierarchy. So hierarchy is exactly what you think it is. It is like the level of importance of elements on a page. So whenever you're laying out a social media post, or laying out your website, like the most important thing should be the biggest. The second thing, you want to look at the second biggest and so forth, and so on. And there's a bunch of different visual ways you can do hierarchy like scales, one proximity of where things are and where someone's looking. So so that's one if something's all the same size, and like if it's all big, the eyes don't really know where it is to look first. So hierarchy is like definitely a tip that not a lot of people know about unless you're really a designer, and really helps kind of guide your users especially when it comes to websites, read through the content and get through it. And kind of the second part of that is called white space. So white space is also what designers use as kind of breathing room in the design. Whether that is a print piece or website. It's exactly what you think it doesn't necessarily have to be white. It could be Like a colored background you're using, but giving like your text or giving your elements, some breathing room, when you're laying them out. I think I see a lot of people who don't have a design background, they want to put as much content as they possibly can on everything. Like they want to put like packaging design, especially if clients come to me and they want to put like every single badge possible. And I'm like, No, this is really detracting from the design, because you need some breathing room or some white space. You know, and, you know, using hierarchy to get that important message across. Again, it's all about communicating. I think those two pieces really help with the communication aspect of design, for sure.
Collin Funkhouser 35:36
Yeah, I love how you mentioned whitespace. I think if someone's listening now and going well, I don't know if I've ever experienced that you definitely have when you've been to a conference, and somebody has a PowerPoint slide, and it is just jam packed. And there's no room for anything else. It's just all 14 point font Times New Roman, from top to bottom. And it's hard to take that whole thing in at the same at once. And what you're saying is, is not to be afraid of that space. And that actually, that actually allows more information to be transferred in a faster manner, because there's not it's just not so assaulting on the eyes.
Kaila 36:09
Yes, whitespace is a good thing. I think a lot of people get scared. They're like, it's a two blank. Like, is it? And I think though that name is a little misleading. So it's not necessarily like has to be white, like you can have a colored background, but just like yes, breathing room is a good thing and allows information to be digested faster.
Collin Funkhouser 36:26
Yeah, absolutely. And and so putting those two things together, what kind of advice would you give to somebody who maybe is just starting out on this process and wants to try and go it alone?
Kaila 36:37
Oh, that's good. I think Addy gain is a really important part of design. I think like I said, everyone wants to put everything in the kitchen sink. And I don't like to tell people not to do that. Because I think it's good to get all your ideas out to get them all out. And then just like, take a step back, go away from it for a little bit, come back to it and just edit, edit, edit, I think that that is what really will lead to any really successful design, whether that's like you're making a social media graphic, or you're making a T shirt for your employees to wear, like, do you really need the logo on the front and the back of the art, you know, like everyone's first I feel like reaction is to put like as much into it as they can, which there is like you can get some really creative ideas when you do that. But I think the key to like being good at design, like, try and do it yourself is to have that editing eye and to really like go back to your foundation of your brand. Ask yourself like, okay, is this resonate with my audience? Is this my brand vibe? Like, is there too much stuff on here? Like, what do I need to do to edit this to make it the best that it can be?
Collin Funkhouser 37:37
That self editing is really, really hard to do, especially, as we mentioned, like, this is this design is supposed to reflect who we are and communicate our beliefs, our feelings, our emotions, the goals that we have, and what we want people to take away. And you can stare at something and go well, I absolutely everything is important on this, so how to work through that editing process to make it productive and still communicate the message that you want.
Kaila 38:06
Yeah, so I like to think of it as like you have someone in like the elevator pitch like you have someone in the elevator for three seconds, like what's going to be what are you going to tell them in that three seconds? Like because you really like whether it's packaging design website, people's attention spans are shorter. I mean, I'm sure we all know that. So you have three seconds to communicate. So like in that three seconds, what is the message you want to get across? Like, do you really need to get across that your, you know, patent pending, made in the USA, like all these other like stuff like that? It's like, Oh, that's probably like, stuff that's really important to you and like secondary information, but like what is the main short elevator pitch you want to get across? And is that being the main thing that's across in this design?
Collin Funkhouser 38:49
Yeah, and really just boiling it down to some bullet points, at least in your mind, or getting those written down in at each stage? stage looking at it going, Okay, do I still have these essentials included in here? Do I still have these essentials included in here. And you mentioned take some time away, step back, breathe, go sleep, go eat, you know, go go get us some space to process that.
Kaila 39:12
Yeah, and some kind of I guess some tips I can give people is so two things when I see someone doing like a social media graphic and they want to like shove a bunch of stuff in there. I'm like, okay, you have a caption to work with. So my my first thing I'm like is okay, like can some of this stuff be put in the caption like if you want to get across the main thing, say you're having an event like really the important thing is like what's the event? What is it that's really all you need to put in there and then put all the other information like where to park what time in the caption so for social media, that's usually the second place I'll put the information for print and stuff like that. I think it's really important to have a call to action, you know, for more information or for blah, blah, blah, go on our website. Follow us like you don't have to have every single thing on that postcard. You can lead people to a secondary spot that goes more into the information And if they go there, you already know that they're a pretty qualified lead and that they're interested. So I think giving people like a path to be able to do that with your information makes design successful,
Collin Funkhouser 40:10
too. And I love how you touched on the difference between digital and, and print media, because I feel like I know I get stuck in the habit of designing everything as if it were going to be printed. Does the same design language for branding translate from print to digital?
Kaila 40:29
That's a good question. Yes, and no, I think the fundamentals are the same. I don't think like a postcard or social media post should have like a ton of stuff on it. But we're digital has a leg up on print is it's interactive. So you have obviously with Instagram, for example, you have the option to do like an Instagram carousel, where you could do like multiple things and making more Instagram or more interactive, have fun with it, you can lead people to a landing page that has videos infographics, more information. So when it comes to digital things, I think the more you can think about it in an interactive, like you're telling people a story, you're leading them through this experience online, and you have you know, you can do extra links, you could do things like that, I think that sort of digital has the leg up on print. Whereas in print, you really just have to like say all the things, there's no way like creative ways you can really get around that. That's why I like to boil down the print to like the absolute essentials and then lead someone into a digital space where you can kind of curate that experience a little bit more thoughtfully,
Collin Funkhouser 41:33
yeah, lean into those strengths and recognize those weaknesses up front and not try and force anything upon those that's actually going to hurt the experience of the user or the client that's trying to get in contact with you.
Kaila 41:45
Yeah, definitely, like most people just want to know like, where they can find your hours and how they can book you. Like they don't want to know, like, they don't want to know all these things. And like if they do, I feel like the website and the digital platform is the place to do that. Because it's you know, it's a little bit of a different user. Like they're already there. Like that's the time and place to do it. But if you're trying to get someone's attention quickly, that is not the place to do it. So you want it like I said do the most absolute essential of communicating that.
Collin Funkhouser 42:13
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Kaila 43:39
that's a good one. Um, brand wise, I think more and more people are starting to realize this but still kind of at a slower rate is you know, getting in front of the camera like introducing yourself. People do want to know if there's a human behind the brand and they want to get to know you. So I think on like social media specifically, like if I follow a brand and like they're not doing Instagram stories, or like I'm not really ever seen, like who the owner is like that kind of somewhat, like even just being a dog mom could be a red flag to me like, Okay, well, who's this person taking care of my hand hold then, you know, so I think the more that are like even just having an about page on your website with like a picture of you on it, like people want to know that there's a person there, I see so many websites that like don't, they'll have an about page, but there's like no picture of them or the team. So I think adding those little personal touches like that. Definitely make a difference. And then also, I think, specifically in the pet space, what I have seen is people want to take it so seriously because you are pet professionals. Yes, you're taking care of animals. It's very important that you get across that sense of professional professionalism. But don't be afraid to like have some personality with your brand like those brands that have the personality and like kind of take a different approach. are the ones I think that stand out and attract their people. You know, like, have fun with it. Like, if that's the type of person you are, I think people are so scared. They're like, Oh, it's got to be like red and blue and half pawprints because I'm in the pet space. Like, that's the standard. And it's like, got to look like that. Like, no, you can like use pink if that's your thing. And like you want to, you know, communicate and get mostly like, you know, millennial parents like little pigs all the rage right now. You know, like, definitely have fun with it and go outside of the box, when it comes to your brand name. Don't feel like you have to be like, so rigid and like fit into like this industry standard. Because I think the industry standard is breaking that industry standard nowadays and kind of being different and having some personality to your brand.
Collin Funkhouser 45:43
Yeah, no, that's, that's so huge. I know, I just speaking from my perspective, it is really hard to break out of that. Okay, well, I have a dog, I have a cat, there's a paw print and a heart, I think I'm good to go right. But playing with those using different shapes, putting them in different combinations. And then not being afraid, as you said, not being afraid to put you into that logo. You mentioned get in front of the camera and put yourself in the logo. And and I think where that starts with is just being comfortable with ourselves and knowing ourselves. Yeah. Right. And it's stepping in confidence and, and surety about what we want to communicate about us. And that can be really, really daunting.
Kaila 46:25
Oh, for sure. Yeah, I know, when I first started my business, I was like, I don't even know like, what to say like, I don't even know if people want to hear me talk. And I make it a point now, like, I'm sure if you follow me on Instagram, you see like, every other day, at least I get on my Instagram stories and just talk like, even if it's not something I just because people want it, you'd be surprised people are following you, they want to know what's going on. Like they want to know, in like, you know, sometimes my personal life blends over with my business, especially with my dogs, because that's like such a big part of my brand. Like people want to like see pictures of my dogs, like know what's going on and stuff like that. So like, that is an easy place to start. Because we are clearly all professionals and are all clearly passionate about pets. So like, Don't feel like you have to get on there and talk about yourself. Like maybe get on there and like talk about what you did with your dog that day or like try to tie it back into like, how your pet professional like, Oh, I can't believe it my dog you're walking. But because of this, this, you know, like framing it like that, I think and making it a personal story helps.
Collin Funkhouser 47:21
It does. Because as you said like that, that allows people to connect with better and then you are talking about something that you are an expert on you right and your business and the things that you are interested in. And yeah, it might not always be directly related to the business, but it's things that you're doing to connect with others and tell that story. And that what I see is that becomes part of this whole brand. As we mentioned, the brand is this big thing. It's what people see, it's what people connect with. And it's you said earlier, it's the vessel, you know, part of the vessel is through the design language and the design being used. But you're building these expectations that people have of you and you're building this face to face connection that people are able to get before they even walk through your door or before they even call you and I the number of people that we get connected with that say, I stalked your social media for about six months. And I feel like I already know you guys. And I want you to take care of my dog like,
Kaila 48:17
yeah, especially like I can. So I don't believe at all. So I can speak for what that probability is. But like, that is the first place I go before I even like consider going to a new hair place going like any Instagram, or like any social media is the first place I go, I'm like, can I find out who owns this business? What are they like? Like, let me tap Let me see, like, you know, their vibe? Are they gonna? like am I gonna vibe with them? Yeah, like, it's, it's important. You definitely want to, like you said, like people want to get to know you before they actually get to know you,
Collin Funkhouser 48:49
which again, is the entire point of the things that we've been talking about is part of that is done through the design language. Part of that is done through the logo through the colors through the font. And then there's this other part of bringing ourselves to the table and using ourselves to talk about the brand talking about things that we're passionate about. And that whole thing is what people are connecting with, and they're going to know you and that's what you want. And that can be scary sometimes because you Oh What if I say the wrong thing? Or what if somebody doesn't like what they see or what if and when we can get caught up in our head sometimes about what we're putting out there. But when we do that, we're actually connecting with the people that we want to be connected with him that we want to be working with his clients like business.
Kaila 49:33
Exactly. I was gonna say, yeah, I think a lot of people like even me, like, I was like, oh, but you know, at the end of the day, like if that person was like you probably don't anyways because that is the beauty of owning your own business is you get to pick the people that you want to work with. But kind of on that note, just some tips because I do have some clients that are like, you know, like Kayla, I'm not 100% comfortable being in front of the camera. Like I get it some people aren't and you know some ways around that. I I've had Some clients, you can still bring your personality to the table without getting it from the camera. And I think one of the fun ways I've seen our clients do it is actually like using their dogs as like the mascot and like doing like the video of their dog and like doing like the voiceover like, we're there like, showing their dog like doing different stuff. But they're like, still the voice like voicing like whatever story it was, they wanted to tell us. So there is other like creative ways you can get around it. And again, that kind of goes back to like thinking outside the box, like it's okay to break industry standard. I just wanted to kind of put that tip out because I do like sympathize, that not everyone is like 100% comfortable getting in front of the camera. But like as long as you can make your personality show through and like, you know, can give some of that behind the scenes, there's different ways you can do it, I do think it's important
Collin Funkhouser 50:43
it is to make sure that you're connecting with the people that you want to be working with. And you you really you said it? Well, there's like that's one of the amazing things that we have as business owners is that we get to work with the people that we want to work with. And how we find those people is through these languages through this branding that we go through so that we're connecting with them at at a very basic fundamental level, where they're like, I like that vibe, I get what that person's putting out there. And I want I want them to take care of my pet. Yeah, definitely. Kayla, I have really, really enjoyed this conversation and the tips that you've given about design and the importance of having a solid brand that is communicating the things that we need to be communicating to our clients. But I know as this is not a college course, and there's a whole lot more involved in this. If people want to get connected, pick your brain and learn more about the importance of design and branding in their business, how can they get in touch with you?
Kaila 51:42
Yeah, so the best way would be first our free Facebook group. So our free group is called design support for small businesses. And I'm sure it will probably be linked in the show notes. But that is a free group for anyone. And in there every single Wednesday, we have what is called our design school. So that is an open forum where we allow anyone to post any design questions they may have. If you're working on a graphic and want more feedback on if you're going through a rebrand with another designer, and you just want a second set of eyes, pretty much you can post in that open forum. And by the end of the day, someone from our team will get back to you and answer your question to the best of our ability. It's also just a really fun group full of a lot of our clients and a lot of professionals, we do monthly trainings and their posts a lot of Canva tips. We also post our freebies every single month with our social media graphics, our team designs for anyone in the group to use. And then the other great place to follow us would be Instagram, our username is at Doc's dx dot design. And on there is where you can kind of follow along behind the scenes. Like I said, I get on Instagram Stories a lot. So you will see a lot of my face. And we do a lot of like the process of our brand, we will sneak peek from sketches to full brand reveals of the clients we're working with. Yeah, it's really fun, Instagram, Facebook would be the two best places. And then of course, our website, which is do x dot design. And that is where you can find all the information on our team and kind of all the services we offer.
Collin Funkhouser 53:17
I love that design domain. That is really cool. And I'm really glad that you guys have
Kaila 53:23
a trip some people up some time. But yes, dot design not.com dot design, they're definitely really fun. But sometimes they get a little
Collin Funkhouser 53:31
tricky. And I will have as you mentioned all of those links in the show notes and on our website. So listeners can get connected immediately, and don't have to worry about putting in the wrong thing. So Kayla again. And again, this has been a real pleasure. Thank you so much. Of course, thank you for having me. I know this was a crash course in design, branding, and then how to use that in our everyday business operations. But I really did have a few big takeaways from this. And the first one was just the sheer importance of design in pet care. And as a pet professional, that if our clients are making assumptions about us and our business, they need to be the right assumptions. And we can communicate that through the design language that we choose, and how our brand is fitting in with who we are as the business owner. And I really agree with Kayla that just getting in front of the camera will do huge things for your business. Not only is it a better way to get connected with clients and potential clients, because remember, they're out there stalking you but but in a good way. It helps us with that it also helps us be more comfortable with who we are and when we are comfortable with who we are as business owner, the brand, the language, the design all flows from that. And so if you post a video this week, or you go live on a social media platform, tag us We would love to see you and get to know you more and hear about your business and everything that you're sharing. And if you don't usually post videos or you don't you Go Live, I guess consider this a challenge to try and do that at least one time this week to introduce something about your business, talk about a service or just give a little bit about your background in your history getting into pet care. We want to thank our sponsors timed pet and pet perennials for making today's show possible. And thank you for listening. We really do appreciate it and we're so thankful for you and for the support that you give the show. We'll be back again soon.
