733: Learning to Let Go Without Losing Control with Maris Sonnabend
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What happens when the biggest obstacle to your business’s growth is the owner? In this episode Maris Sonnabend is back on the show to discuss the difficult but necessary transition from doing everything yourself to becoming a true leader. They explore why systems, delegation, and trust are essential for sustainable growth, even when letting go feels uncomfortable. Maris shares practical insights on identifying the work only the owner can do while empowering others to take ownership. Whether you’re hiring your first employee or leading a growing team, this conversation offers encouragement to build a business that can thrive beyond you.
Main topics:
Transitioning into leadership
Delegation versus control
Building sustainable systems
Creating team ownership
Scaling beyond yourself
Main takeaway: “Your business can only grow to the level that you’re willing to let other people succeed.”
One of the hardest parts of growing a business isn’t finding more clients—it’s learning to let go.
As owners, it’s easy to believe we’re the only ones who can do things “the right way.” But if every decision, every problem, and every client depends on us, our business eventually reaches a ceiling.
In this episode, Maris Sonnabend reminds us that leadership isn’t about doing everything ourselves. It’s about creating systems, building trust, and helping other people succeed.
Growth doesn’t happen because we hold on tighter. It happens because we learn how to lead.
About our guest: Maris Sonnabend is the owner and founder of House of Paws Pet Care. She is also an operations strategist who helps service-based business owners build companies that are sustainable, scalable, and less dependent on the owner. Drawing from years of experience helping entrepreneurs improve leadership, delegation, and operational systems, Maris focuses on practical strategies that empower teams while reducing owner overwhelm. She is passionate about helping business owners reclaim both their time and their vision.
Links:
Previously on: Episode 455
https://www.houseofpawspetcare.com
https://www.facebook.com/houseofpawspetcare/
https://www.instagram.com/houseofpawspetcarellc/
Give us a call!(636) 364-8260
Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed by our guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of Pet Sitter Confessional, its hosts, or sponsors. We interview individuals based on their experience and expertise within the pet care industry. Any statements made outside of this platform, or unrelated to the topic discussed, are solely the responsibility of the guest.
A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE
Provided by otter.ai
Collin 0:02
Welcome to Pet Sitter Confessional, an open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter. Today, we're brought to you by our friends at Timed Pet and Pet Care Growth. Well, hello everybody, and welcome back. Marketing and growing a business are two keys that we think about all of the time. How do I market to grow? But then, how do I handle the growth that I get from the marketing without losing the touch and losing the special uniqueness that I love and my clients love as well? To walk us through both sides of this equation, I'm really excited to have Maris, owner and founder of House of Paws Pet Care, back on the show. Maris, it's been too long. You were with us back on episode 455, and I'm again just elated to have you on. For those who haven't listened to that episode, shame on them. They should go back, pause, and go back and listen to that. Okay, so welcome back. And now, please tell us a bit more about who you are and what you do.
Maris Sonnabend 0:59
Yeah, well, you gave me a great introduction, but my name is Maris Miller Sonavend, and I'm the founder of House of Paws Pet Care in St. Louis, Missouri. I went full time into my business in April of 2021, and as of today, summer of 2026, we're sitting at around 40 staff members with three full time managers, and we serve over 500 active clients this year, which is mind-boggling, especially because compared to where we were, what last time we talked? I mean, I don't remember. You had the numbers, I didn't.
Speaker 2 1:29
Yeah,
Collin 1:31
the last time that Maris was on, she had 12 employees.
Maris Sonnabend 1:36
Crazy. And that what year was that? Was that 2023?
Collin 1:39
2023. Yeah.
Maris Sonnabend 1:41
Wow, that's crazy. It time really flies. I know everyone says it, but my gosh, I didn't even have a kid then, so I know. Whole different, whole different lifetime. Yes, definitely.
Collin 1:54
I know that growth though doesn't come by accident. How are you using? How are you connecting with your potential clients these days?
Maris Sonnabend 2:04
Yeah, so I actually have really been deep diving into where clients are finding us. I'm in this era of well, let's just test this and see what happens. Let's just test this. Like we recently got our car wrapped, and we're in a CRM right now, so we're able to get really granular with things, and I was really shocked to see that Facebook is an even bigger lead generator for us right now than Google. Which, for someone who has run Google Ads for a long time, kind of hurt me a little bit. But it was it was also it was really interesting to really dive into that. And the simple answer is like we post a lot on Facebook and Instagram, but the more complex answer is that we have worked really hard to identify who our favorite clients are. Like not even just like the ones who spend a lot of money with us; those tend to be some of our favorite clients. But like just who our team enjoys working with, who really is on that like 345, day a week template. We've surveyed them a lot, learned a lot about what their pain points are and what they're looking for, why they chose us over other people, and with that, we've been able to really pinpoint where they spend most of their screen time, which has been Facebook and Instagram, and so we post to those things. I think we'll talk a little bit more about what I am posting, but I also take some of those same things and I post them to Indeed and Google My Business to make the Google gods happy. But really, it's it's Facebook that and Instagram Instagram a little bit less, but Facebook for sure that have really been huge drivers for us, and it's it's been really interesting. And with that too, our biggest game changer has been using real pictures of our real staff with pets, like putting faces out there. I'm really lucky that my marketing manager is a photographer, so she does a lot of branded photography for us, and that in the world of AI, where never you're never sure if you're talking to a robot or not. People love seeing other people, and those pictures of our staff with pets get more interaction than any reel we've ever done or any graphic that we've ever made. No matter how cute it is, people just really love seeing that, especially like quality photography too. Not even just like an iPhone selfie.
Collin 4:26
Yeah, that that personal connection. People do crave that. They want to know what's real. They also want to have that, like okay, like these are real people. I have a sense of who they are that they're coming in, and some of that they get from like the total picture of what you're posting of like the long trend of like hey there's a presence here what is that a lot of it though just comes in that like hey that person looks nice I'd like them in my home you know there's there's some of yeah some of that
Maris Sonnabend 4:54
well and it really came from like we are a fully team based business we don't guarantee any certain. Sitter or any any certain time, any of that, and I really wanted our clients to feel comfortable with that because as we grew to 40 plus people at this time, like ideally you don't have five six sitters coming in out of your house for a five day a week client, right? So we really wanted them to feel comfortable with them and knowing like they might not have met them personally, but they know what they look like. They know a little bit more about them based on their bios. Like really honing in on the people aspect has really helped a lot.
Collin 5:30
You started off by saying, "Oh, you were in this. Let's try this. Let's try this. Let's how that's hard. I'm going to just be honest. That's really hard for me to be in that. Let's constantly try new things, especially as we've gotten bigger, the try new things gets kind of scary because I've got more to protect. I've got more to lose. Do you struggle with that at all?
Maris Sonnabend 5:51
Please tell me. There are some people who would wish that I would struggle with it, and some people, as in like my business coach, I work with my husband probably. We talked about it a little bit too ahead of this. Like I am a very early adopter of things, and I'm never going to shoot something down without trying it. I probably should run numbers a little bit better. I probably should evaluate a little bit more. But I really attribute the quick action, and I just maybe I love the risk risk to reward. I don't know. This year has been a big year for us for trialing like direct mailers to client homes and things like that. And again, we got our car wrapped, which I've always wanted. I've wanted that for so long, and I finally just bit the bullet and did it. Google Ads. I just started when we when we talked what three years ago. I was new to it, and I stopped for a little bit. And this is the first year where I have not turned them off once this year. We doubled over last year, so it's again. You just have to try things. I know it's I know it's scary, but you won't know unless you try.
Collin 6:55
And that that really is it. Is is you may know what has worked or what currently is working, but things are constantly shifting around us at all the times. Right, different client perspectives, client biases, client needs, client different sects of the entire market that may be developing that we miss entirely if I'm not putting stuff out there, if I'm not trying things. Plus, it also like I I know I learn new skills and I learn stuff about me, what I'm good at, what I'm not good at, what fits our business, our voice, and that constant like there's this there's this fear of just turning into a manager of your business instead of the entrepreneurship of like hey, and I have to remind myself that a lot of like we started this from nothing like before that like this was there was nothing like this in existence. We that was the biggest risk. Me changing from a carousel to a reel-that's really not that big of a deal.
Maris Sonnabend 7:49
Well, and I think too. I think a lot of people get stuck in just really this ever like they want it to be perfect. And the truth is that nothing will ever be perfect. There's always going to be something to tweak on your landing page or on your flyer or whatever. But again, back to the the world of AI, like it's a useful tool, but people want to see real. They want to see the mistakes, the grammar mistakes, like all of those things. They want to see that because then they know there's a real person behind it. And again, I think really leading into just the humanity of our brand and how yes we work with pets, but we're really there for the people and their peace of mind. It's the core of what we do in our brand.
Collin 8:30
There are things that we can experiment with. There are things we shouldn't experiment with. I think that's a really thing, really important thing to know. Of hey, I don't want to experiment with how I handle the trust of a client, I want to handle how I capture their attention. I want to handle how they hear about me. I want to change those things, but I don't want to necessarily make it. This is the kind of walk you've never experienced before. We're going to do it all upside down or whatever. Like, don't get so
Maris Sonnabend 8:57
many ways you can walk a dog. Yeah, don't don't innovate that.
Collin 9:00
What I know, I know one thing that I see a lot, and like when I go into kind of my doom scrolls on Facebook, sometimes or Instagram, on the reels, like there are those trends that pop up, and I know you're trying. So I'm, I'm really curious, Maris. Like, is it worth it for me as a business to jump on those trends? Like, I'm seeing this one right now, and this will date it because this won't be relevant whenever this comes out. But like the whole trend of like, oh, I'm sitting down for my Netflix documentary, and I'm seeing people in all sorts of industries do that. Like, how do I know should I jump on a trend or should I let it go or should I not? Like, how do you walk that line?
Maris Sonnabend 9:37
Yeah, so I think that really goes back to your ideal client again. There are some things that pop up every once in a while that can be topical for us and what we do. But with our industry too, it's not even worth going viral. I mean, like I can't service people that are 50 miles away from me, let alone states away. So unless you're a content creator too, it's not going to do. Anything for your actual business. That being said, I have to give Rebecca with Skyline Dog Walkers a shout out. She's in Houston. She is phenomenal with doing that, and I have messaged her many a times, like, "Hey, I'm stealing this. Hey, I like that. I'm taking it. Or can you watch this for me to see what you think? Like, please pick it apart. And she always picks me apart, and I love her for it. So I will say, like, trends are not my forte. Like, we are definitely not like super on that. Like, we might be punny. We might have like very millennial, Gen Z type language because that is our ideal client. But I'm not necessarily hopping on like whatever sounds are blowing people up right now because that's not going viral is not my goal at the end of the day. I just want to really land with the people that I want to work with.
Collin 10:48
I think that's really critical. I also like again like you have that phrase of who's my favorite kind of client. I think typically we may phrase it as oh who's my ideal client avatar, which is a more technical term, but I love how you originally phrased that. Of like, who's my favorite? Who do I actually want to work with? Who are the people who we love, and including who my team loves to work with? What are those kind of people? And then it's all about how do I talk to them? How do I stand out to them? How do they know about me? And if that does include being kind of trendy and catching up on those things, okay, you may need to explore that. But if not, right? What are they looking for? And that really is a distinction between like, what do I want as the business owner and guider and visionary here versus what do my my clients want? So there is going to be a little bit of a gap, so to speak, between those. At least I know for us. I know there's like, hey, I know how I would market. I would say things, but I'm not my client, so I do have to curb more to their desires and kind of their proclivities too.
Maris Sonnabend 11:55
Yeah, definitely. Well, I think too, like especially when I think of our industry, there are some people who lean like very exclusive leaning, like they have the very high end feel, and there's some people who really want that calm, relaxing feel. If you go on my website, it is pink, it is honey. Like we have all these crazy patterns, and that is either going to suck in the right person, or it's going to take the wrong person and send them far, far away, and and and that was intentional. Like, and my rebrand came out right when Barbie was coming out, so pink was it. And I am not a very pink person at all. Like, my hair is blue. I wear a lot of blue purples, sure, but like pink is not me. And that was something that was really hard for me to sit with for a little bit. Was like this isn't like I, I don't love it. It's not something like I would wear this on a day to day basis. But the people that I want to surf more of would love it. So we're just diving into it.
Collin 12:59
Yep, there's always that that part of what is my my business need versus what do I want, and I think that's another yet another distinction of I have to kind of put myself aside to make this happen and make this work.
Maris Sonnabend 13:12
But on that same note, too, I think it's also important that you build a business that does work for you. I think a lot of people get stuck in that trap of building a business that works for everyone else, or a brand that doesn't align with anyone, I think that's where it gets really dangerous. Even because if you speak to everyone, you're really speaking to no one, and that was a huge change in my mindset in regards to marketing for me.
Collin 13:36
Well, it means it means though having an opinion, you have to have an opinion, right? And and being being strong in that opinion, and and that means that I necessarily have to step out and away from maybe where I'm comfortable or where everybody else is talking or everybody the way everybody else is looking. I need to step out and say no. I'm going over here, which does take a level of confidence and boldness in order to do that, and especially to execute it well and repeatedly.
Maris Sonnabend 14:06
Yeah, definitely. Well, again, I mean, you kind of hit a nail on the head of being a differentiator, like especially again in the world of AI, when someone your your ideal client is out there searching on ChatGPT. I need to find a dog walker near me who knows how to deal with anxious pets and blah blah blah blah blah? Like they're not just googling dog walker near me anymore. And if you are speaking to the person that chat knows pretty well, pretty deeply, if they're talking to chat like that, they've had many of conversations. They are going to search through all the dog walkers near you, and they're going to say, "Hey, I think this is the best fit for you because they talk about how they deal with anxious pets and they talk about how they send these report cards and how they specialize and they have all these like fear-free certifications and that's your differentiator because the reality is I offer the same services as you and you offer the same services as every. Their dog walker pets. They're like we all offer the same services. So what is going to set you apart from the next person?
Collin 15:06
And that man. So maybe we'll sit with that, and and because immediately we think, well, I have to offer a different service, or I have to walk the dog upside down to be different than the next person, or I have to do this, or I have to do that. And it's finding those those those differentiators, which more often than not, it's in the tone and the customer service and the experience that that person have. I just got off a phone call today with a client who only needed us while they were recovering from a pretty intensive surgery, and that we were doing litter box cleanouts and scoops, you know, every day for them, and then the big cleanouts once a week. He's fully recovered now, and he's like, "Hey, I that it was the most simple of service. It took 15 minutes, and he the one thing that he railed on on the phone was everyone was so professional. Everyone was so wonderful when they were in my home. I can't imagine using anybody else. He didn't say anything about how well we scooped the litter box, Mary. It was all about how nice the people were and how they talked to him and greeted him, and that was his one takeaway. Was just like, I this is amazing. This is the best, amazing, most amazing service ever. Like finding those ways to stand up to your clients is really where a lot of that differentiator comes from.
Maris Sonnabend 16:21
100% and two. I mean, again, think about just going to the grocery store. There is probably one brand that you tend to go to more than the other, or like one. We're like, well, if I have to go there, I'll go to this one. But I'd rather go to Target because Target is fun and it has that vibe. And I, when I was getting my brand done by Pet Marketing Unleashed, just a little casual drop in there. They ask you what store you want to feel like, you want your brand to feel like, and they gave comparisons of like Apple to Lululemon to Target to Walmart, all these things. And I said Target because I wasn't like the most expensive per se. I'm getting up there, but I wanted that fun feel, and I knew that the people that shop at Target are probably the type of people that I want to serve as a dog walking client. So it was it was really interesting, kind of shifting. Like if I was a store you're walking into, how did you want to feel when you go in there? So that's a really fun way of looking at it too.
Collin 17:17
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Speaker 3 17:22
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Collin 17:43
If you're looking for new pet-sitting software, give TynedPet a try. Listeners of our show will save 50% off your first three months by visiting tinedpet.com/confessional. Well, it's one thing to say, okay, I've identified what they like. It's another thing to then talk to them consistently, and I think that's the part where a lot of us fall down. How do you stay consistent in your brand voice in your connection with that client, regardless of what medium you're trying and testing out?
Maris Sonnabend 18:12
Yeah, so it goes back to that client survey again, too, right? Like we with the client survey, we were able to really better understand client pain points, and from that, I created our brand promise. And our brand promise is on our website, but it's not-it's in our service agreement too. And our brand promise is to provide peace of mind for clients while they're away, to show our passion for pets for every animal we care for, and to raise the standard of care for all pets as well. So everything we do, say, and show is meant to reinforce that in some way. We might not explicitly say that's what we are doing, but they know that we live by that, and we are showing you that we will do it. Whether that's through the pictures that we post, or the things that we talk about, and or the policies that we enforce, we have our policies not because we want to be a pain in the butt, but because we have standards that we want to uphold, and that's a that's a huge part of it is really leaning into standards that you live by, and those standards should be built for that client you want to serve.
Collin 19:17
I love that. Not it's not abstracting it. It's it's actually grounding it in something, grounding it in principles because those become the guides for what you do. And you're right. It's not like I think many times they think, oh, in order to be consistent. Okay, many times. Okay, Collin thinks many times to be consistent. You have to say the same things all the time. You have to. I just. I need to find my little my little trademark phrase, and that's my catchphrase. And if as long as I say that, that's me being consistent. And and and I love what you're talking about here, Maris. Of like, no, you can say. Please say different things. Don't just copy and paste the same thing every time you make a social media post. And and you have guides. On it because you know why you're writing it, you know to whom you are writing it, and you know what you want to be writing about, and those help frame everything about that. And when we don't have those, that's when we start to just feels like everything's jumping all over the place, and we lose that cohesion.
Maris Sonnabend 20:18
Yeah, and sometimes social media can feel like throwing spaghetti at a wall. I'm not gonna lie. Like there's sometimes where all of a sudden our views are going through the roof, and we're getting tons of interactions, or something blew up that I don't know why it did, but whatever. We're just gonna roll with it. And there's some things where I I spent an hour working on one post or one blog, and it it had nothing. There was no traction to it, and it's just the constant changing of the algorithms too. If something's working for you right now, I can promise you it won't next month. Like it is, it's just a constant change of stuff all the time. And the last thing I want to do is contribute more fluff to the algorithm than what people are looking at. But I do want it to be a. If you're scrolling, you see my brand colors, and you know, okay, that's House of Paws stuff. I want to stop and look at it really quick, and that's why. Like, we'll post a simple picture of a dog, like a really nice picture of a dog. But we will always put our logo in that bottom right corner. It won't even be a logo with our name on it, but it just has that on there. It's a very small touch of the brand because anyone can throw a picture up of a dog, but I want them to know in that bottom right-hand corner you'll always see a little logo that's us. It's just the brand consistency over time,
Collin 21:29
and it's just it's such a wonderful, it's such a light touch, but it's also so important because they see it, they remind it, the colors that everything is involved in that. I mean, have you? You've talked about how things have changed, and you're always testing new things. Have your views changed on social media? Oh gosh,
Maris Sonnabend 21:48
yes. Oh, okay. I'll set the timer here. Well, and I think again, it goes back. Like I used to think that posting more would just think I would get more clients, right? But it goes back to that consistency and trust building over time for the brand as a whole. So, like really fleshing out our brand voice, and not just our colors and the fonts, but like the actual tone and the words we use and the words we don't use. Like, and that follows through to our report cards. Like, just that consistency through when a client sees us on social media down to the report cards that they get. That consistency through it all. It really, we we really want clients to feel something when they use us, and I want them to feel that just by going through our social media. So, my view on social media in general is again not doing the thing that's viral right now, but what is going to maintain the brand feel and have clients have that same feeling as they scroll through their many things on Facebook or Instagram or whatever? Because truly, once they start comparing us to the hobby sitter next door who probably charges half of what we do, I want them to go with us because they felt something different, and they know they don't have to worry. I want them to know they're making the right choice, even if it costs a little bit more than they originally planned.
Collin 23:10
Yeah, and that's that. That's that gap that we have to try. That we know that we're trying to fill, or at least get them to jump across. Is we know we're not the most. We know we're not the the least expensive. We're not might not might not be the most expensive, but we know we're more than what people typically expect to be to paying for this. And so to get them to feel something to and and I mean you've you've mentioned the surveys a couple times. How often are you sending those surveys out? And like you don't have to talk about all the questions, but I am curious. Like, what what kind of like general things are you trying to understand each time you send out one of those surveys?
Maris Sonnabend 23:47
Yeah, so I will say this is the first year I try to send them out twice a year, like beginning of the year and probably around fall, like right when our big dog walking rush comes in. And this was the first year that I really segmented that client survey. I used to just send them to all of our active clients. Like all the people we keep in our scheduling software have booked with us in the last 18 months. So in January we do a comb through of anyone that hasn't used us in the last 18 months, and then in July we do that comb through, and that's when we send that survey out, or like around those times. So this year was the first time I did a cat client specific one, and then a dog walking specific one. I intentionally did not survey dog sitting clients because I've determined that's not my ideal client right now. I just keep giving more and more niches. And I was asking our cat clients, like, what had you picked? I really asked them, why did you pick House of Paws over someone different? If we did not exist, who would you use instead? What keeps you scheduling again? Like very specific questions about why, essentially why us? Like why did you pick us? And what has been the biggest differentiator for you for using us versus using? Who you used before, and really using those in our marketing as well. And people, I have plenty of people say for our dog walking side that they would just rush home in between work if they didn't have us. Okay, great, let's speak to that because I know someone's doing that right now. Like, so let's do that. Or the kids didn't let the dog out on time, so I have to. I'm cleaning up accidents whenever I get home. Those types of things. Yeah.
Collin 25:24
Well, and that's a bold question to ask, right? Why are you still using us, or what kind of like? I know that when we've asked in the past, there were times where I had my hopes built up that they were going to respond with like, "You're the most amazing thing ever, and everything was perfect and wonderful, and blah blah blah. And a lot of the feedback would come back and basically be like, "You were available when I needed you, and you were like, and you did what you said you would. And I was just like, "Oh, that's not exciting. Well, I was there when you needed me. Oh, come on! But the more I thought about it, I was like, "Wait a minute, that's kind of the whole point of us, of us, the way we're doing is this: we're here when you need us, so why am I sad when that's all they write about why they use our service, right?
Maris Sonnabend 26:06
Truly, well, and I think it's this really interesting thing too, where no one's going to take your business as personally as you, and when you ask for that feedback, God, it's so easy to take it personally, and because to us, our business is our whole world, but to our clients and our staff, our business is just like either their job or it's something that they use whenever they need it. You could even be a backup to the backup, but they know that you're there when you say you're going to be there because that's part of the promise that you gave and you follow through with it. And one day that will be the reason why someone chooses you because you talk about that. Maybe you write a blog about it. I don't know, but using those little stories and really leading into that too is a huge part of it.
Collin 26:48
It is because it helps them stay. It helps them know, hey, what am I? What am I here for? What am I? Who for whom am I for? People who want somebody who's going to show up, and I think that's one of the most beautiful things you can have somebody say about you is you showed up whenever no one else did or would, and it's like, yeah, exactly. I
Maris Sonnabend 27:05
know. I keep hearing from all these people, like not industry related, but like they're trying to find a contractor for their house, and they might like keep having people come over for quotes, and then they don't give the quote, or they do, and then they get ghosted. Like just showing up, it's half the battle for some people. And if you know that you can show up every time, talk about it. If you know that you can take every last minute request and you will find a way to always fit them in, talk about it. That's a differentiator. It doesn't have to be something crazy. Like it doesn't.
Collin 27:31
It doesn't. And you and then you lean into that. And and I think many times you're right. Like we we we feel so deeply about our business that we want everything to be the super emotional thing and whatever, whatever, and then sometimes it's just a practical thing. We solved a problem and we do it well and consistently. Run with that if that's like that is so that very few people actually do that. So we should be proud of that kind of feedback. But we have to be brave enough to ask for that in the first place.
Maris Sonnabend 27:56
And my biggest advice too, if you send out that client survey, just you're not always going to get the feedback that you want, but when you get that feedback that you didn't really want,
Collin 28:06
yeah,
Maris Sonnabend 28:07
grow from that. Take it. Don't just say, "Well, that person's just bitter, or "That person just doesn't understand the back end of
Collin 28:13
it.
Maris Sonnabend 28:13
Listen to them and think about how you can fix that, or how you can better explain some of your policies or procedures. It's all of it is a learning curve, and all feedback is good feedback. If you ask me,
Collin 28:26
okay. So you've we've mentioned at the beginning how you've grown quite a bit. What surprised you most about that process?
Maris Sonnabend 28:37
Oh man, I think the biggest thing for me was I have learned that my team is a lot better at doing some of these things than I am. I have pushed off a lot of things that were on my plate originally to other people that I brought on specifically for their talents. Like my hiring manager is a much better person at hiring than I am at this point. My marketing manager, she is so much better with like the actual strategy of it than I am. I am like the idea creator. I'm like, hey, I saw this post. Do something with it that is something similar. Do
Collin 29:13
the thing. Yeah, do
Maris Sonnabend 29:15
the thing, please. That that you do that makes a lot of magic. Or hey, I I came up with this blog topic. Write the blog, and and my gosh, even just down to the visits at this point. Like I will do, I'll do visits every once in a while, but I am inevitably distracted by something going on because I am, I guess, the head honcho, or and I have a baby, and I have a husband, and I have all these animals, and inevitably I am distracted by something if I'm doing a visit, and my team, their whole focus is the pet. Like my team is better at doing visits than me at this point. So as soon as I let go of all of only I can do everything, things just got so much easier, and I was able to pull things off my plate, and it's it's just such more, so much more sustainable. Now and we're doing more than we've ever done before, and I've taken more time off this year than I ever have before because I don't feel like I have to own everything.
Speaker 2 30:11
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Collin 30:44
Has your team been okay with the growth that you've experienced? Because I know that as like as we have grown, I've had to have some conversations with people about the level of busyness, the more responsibilities. Do you want this? Do you not? What is again that whole like what does the business need and who's going to fill that? And are we okay with how things are? Like, have you had those kind of conversations with your team?
Maris Sonnabend 31:08
We've had a lot of new people in the last year and a half, but we also have people that have just hit their one year, their two year with us, and that are asking for ways to grow. And growth is always going to create friction, whether that's friction with you, friction with your team, and the friction that I learned really quickly is that no one's going to hold up to the 15-hour days like I did when I was first starting out this business. So I've really, I've really taken the approach of always being slightly overstaffed because I want I don't want anyone to work as hard as I did to get this off the ground and I think that's also kind of helped. Like there was a question recently in one of the Facebook groups like how do you make sure your staff doesn't take your clients? I'm like because they see all the stuff that we deal with, and they they just show up for their shift and they go home. Like they don't have to do anything else in between. They can have time off whenever they ask for it. Whenever they're off for the day, I'm not expecting them to answer. Like I have very strict boundaries for their work life balance that I did not enforce for myself for a long time. And we had a fun little benefits too. Like we have the Panera free drink perk. They can go get a drink from Panera whenever they want. We just recently introduced paid for oil changes. That's been a huge hit with our team, and we're just flexible around people's lives. So overall, I think they're pretty dang happy with the growth because, again, even with us growing, they still have full control over their schedule. And post pandemic, that's truly what people care about. They just want more autonomy in their life, and we allow them to have that between other jobs, or school, or family, whatever that is for them.
Collin 32:45
Well, and I'm reminded too. You mentioned you've had a lot of new people added. How they don't know any different about the business operations, whatever they come into, that's just their normal. And and I forget about that every single time because I feel like I have to explain to them about what's going on and how it's not normal, and they're like, "What are you talking about? I don't know. I wasn't here last week, Collin. And I'm like, "Right, right? You don't know that this is way different. Okay, cool. Yep. Just we're doing always do. That's how we've always done things. Yes. This is totally what we've always 100% done for since we started. Okay, moving on, and I think, but it's such also like so wonderful to have those new people coming into the business. Not only mean you know because you are growing, you're serving more people, but also like their eyesight into the business, their thoughts about how things are going. Like all of that stuff is so refreshing to have when you when you talk to them, whenever you reach out to them, like how are you like? Because another thing that happens in this, and this is a thought that I've had, is as we have grown and as I know businesses grow, we focus on like connection to the client, make sure it's personal, keep the humanity in the service, do all this stuff. How are you doing that with your team though? Because with 40 people, I don't know, Maris. How many of their birthdays do you know right off the top of your head? Right, like
Maris Sonnabend 34:07
my sister's. Who's my hiring manager? There you go. Okay, so like, because
Collin 34:12
that's that that kind of thing. It's like, oh, when you start hiring, it's like, okay, well, I'm going to send them a birthday card, or I'm going to do like. How are you maintaining that kind of connection with your team as you've grown to 40 employees.
Maris Sonnabend 34:24
Yeah, well, and gosh, that goes back to delegating a lot too, right? So, like my hiring manager, the first thing she does when she asks someone time to pet is she's creating tasks, and that's for their birthday, their one year anniversary. All of those things are going to be in there because we know they're going to pop up. We will not miss it. I will not miss a staff member's birthday, even if I'm off. I am in their messaging. We put it in like the general announcements for the whole team, and we all say happy birthday. And or if it's their anniversary, oh my gosh, congrats on your one year! We're so lucky to have you. We have a channel in Slack for our shoutouts. If we get a five star review that mentions someone, we're posting that. The whole group and being like, oh my gosh, thank you! Like you did awesome, great job. And if they mention they have something personal going on, we are making note of that and we're reaching back out, like, hey, the shifting in on you. Hope you're feeling okay. Sending flowers to staff if they lose a pet or a family member, whatever that looks like. It doesn't need to be this big thing every time, but just something that acknowledges that they are human outside of work, and even if I, as a business owner, don't have a life outside of work, I acknowledge that they do, and I want them to. And and the feedback that we've always gotten because we send exit surveys out to all of our staff that eventually leave, and we tell them like we want to hear like how we could have better supported you. If did you feel like you had the support in the field? Did you feel like you had the support during your training? Did you feel like your training was adequate? And we take that feedback again and we use it. I'm really proud of the onboarding process we have right now, though we've spent a lot of time in it. The Joey Coleman never loses an employee again. Won the book. Second, the workshop at the Dog Coast Summit last year was just absolutely phenomenal. And but there's always ways to improve it, right? But the overall culture again, I think, goes back to the brand of the people that we attract are also our our ideal staff member, truly. And we are very explicit on our website as to why you would and would not want to work for us, and I think that's done a lot for us as well.
Collin 36:27
Sometimes you you have to be explicit in that way of saying if you are like this might not be a bad good fit. If you're like this, we'd love for you to apply, and that's just being honest with people. And that's been some feedback that we have gotten over the years of people people who've applying. We we have a very extensive process and screening process of new hires. And one thing that we get a lot of is, hey, I appreciate your honesty about this position. I don't think this is going to be a good fit for me. And the and then I'm like I'm I'm like oh okay. At first, I was like, "Oh man! And then I went, "Well, the whole reason I'm saying this is so that they're going to weed themselves out. So I'm glad that this is glad that this is working.
Maris Sonnabend 37:07
Truly, yes. And even if you're excited about someone, please like, like almost not over exaggerate what the job is, but kind of really nail home. Like this is not like play with puppies and get cat kettles all day. Like you're gonna walk in the extreme heat, you're gonna drive your own car there. If it's snowing, sorry, we still have to go out and let dogs out. We might reprioritize some things, but that's the reality of the job. Especially, gosh, being in St. Louis, Missouri, we had 125 degree day on Monday, so I'm not gonna lie to my team and be like oh no he'll just like just hang out in your AC all the time because that's not happening.
Collin 37:46
But but part of those processes are you have these automated things built in. You have a checklist for everybody who comes in so that you capture that information. It's like how do we wow our clients that we remember things? Well, we write it down, right? And it sounds so simple. Just write down their birthday, put it in a place where you're going to remember. And if you do that for everyone, you're never going to miss it. And that kind of stuff, you'd be surprised that if you're listening to this and you don't think this, if you have employees, if you just wish them a happy birthday, whether it's in the you know just a direct text or phone call or a card to them, or just in Slack or Pumble or whatever you're using, that little gesture makes them feel so seen and known, and and like you can change people's days with a simple "I remember your birthday, and it's not because I'm friends with you on Facebook. Ah, how about that? Right? Like, like it's so simple, but but it helps people see that there is this connection there. And yeah, did we write it down? Oh, it feel. Oh, I cheated. I wrote it down. Sure, whatever. No, it's it's you wanted. It was so important to you that you don't want to forget it. That you put it somewhere, and that allows you to have that connection with that person that you wouldn't have otherwise,
Maris Sonnabend 39:02
definitely. And I think something that we've really been working on as a company, like with my management team, is that I'm one of those people where I'm like, leave me alone unless you're telling me I'm doing something wrong. That way, I can fix it. If I'm doing a good job, leave me alone. Stop talking. A lot of my team is not like that, though. Yeah, a lot of my team wants that constant affirmation. So we actually just changed it in the last few months. Where I require for every manager shift, you send one compliment out. I don't care if that's you pull a cute picture they took and post it in Slack for everyone to see of their favorite photos, and you say, "Oh my gosh, awesome picture at whoever! Like you did fantastic! Like this is so this is so cute because that also tell my marketing manager to post on social media. It's a dual thing right there, but that was some of the feedback we got. That people just felt like we were only coming at them if they had if they didn't do something right. And again, I'm one of those people. Again, leave me alone unless I'm doing something wrong. That way, I can fix it. But a lot of my team is not. That so we really had to change a lot of that internal structure of being very persistent with the constant like yes you're doing awesome I like we love having you on the team and really reiterating that that way it felt like a safe space to come to also
Collin 40:14
no I this this fantastic we have that has been a focus of ours of trying to find something to comment on and putting it in their file so that when we do have our one-on-ones, we can bring that up or complimenting about that in that moment. We had we had a lady who worked for us. She, you know, she she ended up moving out of the area, but she you know she was in her 50s and she was like, I've never been in a job that was so supportive and encouraging. That's the best
Maris Sonnabend 40:42
compliment. The best.
Collin 40:43
Yeah, she was like, "I didn't even get this much compliment from my mother, and I was like, "Okay, that might okay. But it was like, because I just, I, I, I too am very much a person who it's like, just let me go about my work. Just let me work. And we have those kind of people, and we recognize them. Okay, I don't need to make sure I shout you out all the time, but we get to learn those people. How do you like to be acknowledged? Asking those kind of questions during the onboarding, so I can curtail what we do here, and we still shout them out, even though they might be like, "Stop showing my photos. It's like, no, they're great. I'm going to let you know that. We still do that sometimes, but it just it gives people that that, and yes, it's it's on a schedule. It's being monitored. Managers are doing it, but they know somebody's looking at my work. Somebody's because man, how many times was I in the field sending these like pouring everything into the photos and writing these amazing updates and you know really like doing everything I could in this visit and didn't hear a single peep from the client, all the time, and it hurt me, and I really got frustrated by it because I ended up being like, "Why am I going to all this extent? The client's not saying anything. I don't want that for my team. They need to get feedback, and if not from the client, from me, I'm going to let them know that you're doing it. You're really rocking this.
Maris Sonnabend 41:56
Well, and even on that same note too, like if there's a client that's just they're that type of client. They're always going to have something to nitpick or something to complain about. My team knows that we will always go to bat for
Collin 42:07
them
Maris Sonnabend 42:08
unless we did something like obviously wrong. But if it's a client that's just being nitpicky or not even just nitpicky, but like they're just finding something to complain about, and again, unless we did something obviously wrong, I will always double down for my team because we are so specific about who we hire. They know we always have their back, and like again with the with the heat, if someone complains about a dog not getting a full 45 minute walk in 100 degree weather, okay, yeah, well my team is important and their safety is important. So yeah, we pivoted to the last 10 minutes of inside play time, and I gave them permission to do that, actually, and them just knowing that they're being supported too. Because like I came from corporate retail, and that was very much so you do what corporate says; otherwise, you three strikes a year out. And of course, there's still a line that you have to hold as far as quality. But if you train your team, and you give them the tools to succeed, and they use them. Then, yeah, you have to back them up because no, the client's not always right. And I'd rather lose one client than a staff member any day of the week. Truly,
Collin 43:12
yeah. No, I we had we had an incident one time where a third party questioned whether we had arrived and done a visit or not. Barris, I I don't I don't get mad. I don't get mad for a lot of things. But questioning the work of my employees, I will. I I no. I I actually I flew off the handle, and I was so like, don't you dare attack the integrity of these people of these amazing humans who are here, like I like, not only am I going to pull it up and show you on our on our software because yeah, I have software and it'll pinpoint where they were and how long they were. You didn't think of that, did you? But also, these are amazing people, and they work so hard to show up here every day at these times. And I don't you ever question their integrity. Like I, there are a few things that I will let Roy, you know, make my blood boil. But questioning the integrity and the morals of my team don't don't even like we're not we don't play about that. Like this is truly we do here.
Maris Sonnabend 44:12
Yeah, we would not be what we are without them. And I've said that so many times to my management. Like our our staff is what makes us. They are who embody our brand day every day because they're the ones that are out there doing the work, and we wouldn't be here without them. So we are going to make sure that they are a priority overall, and that's what everybody's why we highlight them in our socials and why we post about them and we show them off because we're proud to have them. And people, it's it's hard to find a job that cares about their staff, as awful as that fun as that sounds. And I did not create this business to be a ruler of anyone, maybe of myself. But that's a me problem, not a them problem. And in the end, they can leave whenever they want. So I want to make sure I keep them, especially if I love them and they are a great culture fit for.
Collin 45:01
Yeah, well, and it and it's it's finding everything in that we we recently did a team survey, and I just I just had to pull this up. We recently did a team survey about like what what do you love about working here? We asked the question, what do what don't you like? And then there's the other thing of like, okay, now tell me what you do like because I do want to hear that. And the person wrote, "The compassion seeps through all that you do, literally from the scheduling to the visits to the meetings. It's all there. Yeah, and I was like, "Okay, I'm gonna go here and cry. Yeah, that would make me
Maris Sonnabend 45:35
cry.
Collin 45:36
And what's great is like I'm not even one doing the scheduling anymore. Like I'm not even the one doing this. It's our it's our admin, it's our manager who's putting all this in. But she's got the behind the reason behind what we do, and it's like yeah, that's that's how we can have personal connection with people is that they see that we when it says we care, we care about your schedule and accommodating what you need and all this stuff. And yeah, we're going to get cards and birthdays, and and it's because you matter. It's because you matter, and when we remember that, everything else just flows from
Maris Sonnabend 46:07
it. 100% It's it's again going back to the roots of it all. And if you always operate from those values, it will show. As soon as you start straying from those values too, though, that will also show. Whether that's for your clients or for your staff, if you start doing it for the money, if you start doing it for anything other than just making sure your people and pets are happy, it will start showing.
Collin 46:30
Yeah. Well, and so part of that is, I mean, quality of service. Quality of service is one thing that we always want to make sure that we nail. How are you maintaining those high qualities and high standards as you've scaled and added 40 employees?
Maris Sonnabend 46:48
Oh gosh, it's been a beast-one that we're still trying to figure out right now. We are in a really cool time right now to have AI. As much as I've said, like, hey, in the world of AI, you have to be different. AI has really helped us a lot too. We have a tool that I've created in Claude that reads through all of the our visit report cards that come through, and they specifically look for the brand, the report card being on brand and on brand for us is fun emojis, punny, like great photos. It's looking for those things, and also we require certain leashes on walks. They have two points of contact. Shout out to rescue rope leads. She is fantastic. We've been working with her from the beginning. Every one of my staff members has them. At least three: two big ones and one small one. So making sure those are being used that prevents dogs escaping. The way we train our staff members is the same across the board and very very particular. I don't want anyone going into a client home on their own without feeling like they know exactly what should happen going in there. But that being said, it is something that it's not perfect by any means, and we're still trying to find things that fix that and put it all together and make it seamless, but in the end, dogs are dogs and people are people, and something is always going to happen that we haven't planned for. But again, it goes back to my staff. I always know that the decisions that they make are based on the safety for the pets and themselves, and that's why I'll always stand behind them and assume that every decision they made was with with good intention, right? And I think that goes back to if their training set them up for success, and they lean back on their training in moments where they aren't sure, then that quality will always be there because it goes back to us, our guarantee of a of raising the standard of pet care overall,
Collin 48:42
really viewing that that training and onboarding process as setting the standard, setting the the the foundation for them. I think that's really the difference there. It's not me showing you how to do work; it's me showing you the standard that we stand upon. It's showing you where we need to make and pull decisions from, not just here's how you care for this pet, and here's how you care for this pet, and here's how you care for this pet, and here's how you care. That that was took me a long time to kind of tease apart. Was okay when people I'd have people shadow, and was like we'd go through, and I just felt like I was just showing them how to do this client, this client, this client, this client, this client, this client, this, and then I reach the end, I'd be like, did they actually learn anything, or did I just teach them how to do 10 clients that they're not going to see for another week? Like that, what was the point? Wait, wait, what was the point of that? And so, really, like stepping way back and going, what's the commonality here? What are the standards? What do we expect? That's what I train, and then if I can train that, it doesn't matter who you go into, like I'm going to train you now. You can with confidence, and there'll be notes here for you to follow.
Maris Sonnabend 49:49
Yeah, well, and same thing on the client side too. Like our new client onboarding is very specific. Like we are that we onboard every client the exact same way because I know that the experience. Leading up to that will be the exact same, and that experience has led to a lot of client conversion. So I know that it works, and it is always being tweaked. But it's the messaging that we send, how we follow up afterwards. All of those things are a part of the process that are also part of the guaranteed quality that you'll get when you come when you work with
Collin 50:20
us, yeah, and and then that lives itself out in the execution of, like you said, of the of the team members, the people who are showing 100% right? Like it's it's it's a yes and you don't get one without the other.
Maris Sonnabend 50:33
Yeah, definitely, yeah, because if the client isn't doing their part, and they do have the hefty part, like the report, the profiles we have them fill out. I tell them, I was like, I always say, listen, it's a lot at first. I promise, going forward, it's a lot easier. But you're gonna have like 100 fields to fill out. I'm so sorry. I'd rather have the information and not need it than need it and not have it. It also makes my team's life easier. So we're work. It's okay. Always a work in progress.
Collin 51:00
Maris, where are the next three years taking you?
Maris Sonnabend 51:03
Oh gosh, who knows? Oh, I couldn't even tell you truly. It's I couldn't even picture myself here three days three years ago. The last time we talked, we are on track for a bigger and better business. Is all I can say, and I I really do love doing what we do, and I found that I really love the back end of things and the marketing and things like that. So I really hope to I would love to help other pet businesses with that one day, but my gosh, I have to nail ours down even more. I feel like before I could even all this talk about it, and I still feel like I'm still learning, and you always are truly.
Collin 51:41
Yeah, absolutely, Maris. Thank you so much for coming on the show today. I have just I just so enjoyed our conversation and thanks for having me. Very inspired to go out and make sure that we nail our team onboarding and our team connection, as well as how we connect with our new clients and potential clients looking out for this. So for those, I know this is a lot. There's a lot tied up into this. And so for those who may want to pick your brain or connect with you on whatever topics, how best can they do that?
Maris Sonnabend 52:11
Yeah. So you can find me on Facebook at Maris Kate Miller Sonapend. I know that's a mouthful, but you'll find me. I'm on a lot of the Facebook groups or Instagram at House of Paws Pet Care LLC, and our Facebook page is also House of Paws Pet Care. So I'd love to talk to you.
Collin 52:28
Love it. Well, I will have those links in the show notes and on the website so people can connect with you there, Maris. Once again, this has just been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much.
Maris Sonnabend 52:38
Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. See you in three years.
Collin 52:44
My favorite part about my conversation with Maris was when she said that your business can only grow to the level that you're willing to let other people succeed. How true when we first bring on an employee to walk dogs and take care of cats for us. I have to let them have the space and the trust from me to be successful. It's one of the hardest parts of growing a business. It's we often think it's finding more clients, but it's not. It's just learning. We have to learn to let go, because it's easy that we can grow to believe over time that we're the only ones that can do things right the the quote unquote right way. But if every decision and every problem and every client fully and wholly depends on us, then our business will reach a ceiling, and that's okay. That's perfectly okay if that's what we want, and that's we have to understand that about ourselves. Again, we have to stress there's no right or wrong way to run your business. But Maris here is really reminding us that leadership isn't about doing everything ourselves. It's about creating systems. It's about building trust with more than just between us and the clients, and it's about helping other people be successful with the goals and aspirations that they have. The trap that most of us fall in is when we want to grow and expand our business? We go out and we market and we market and we market and we work on getting new clients. But what we never do is actually grow and develop and nurture strong employees and a strong team that can take on and help us actually grow and serve the people that we're bringing into it. Instead, we try our best to continue to control and act like we're the only one in the business, and everyone else is just there because they're a nuisance and they're kind of in our way. That is where so many businesses fail time and time again. Growth doesn't happen because we hold tighter and tighter to the things around us. Growth happens when we learn to lead and let go. We want to thank our sponsors today, Tined Pet and Pet Care Growth, for making this show possible, and we really want to thank you so much for listening. We hope you have a wonderful rest of your week, and we'll be back again soon.
