665: Leading Through the Next Level In Your Business with Marie and Justin Plummer
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What happens when your business grows faster than your systems—and regulations force you to rebuild everything? In this conversation, Marie and Justin Plummer of Winston-Salem Dogcare share how North Carolina’s Animal Welfare rules pushed them from “in-home” into a fully regulated, facility-based setup and what that required financially and operationally. We talk about the mindset shift from feeling like problems are “happening to you” to showing up as a prepared problem solver. They unpack how staff surveys revealed unseen disconnects, and how professional development became a retention tool once the team began treating pet care as a long-term career. Finally, we dig into preserving client connection at scale—using boundaries, a flexible “gray area,” and a reminder that your software is just a tool, not the heart of your business.
Main topics:
Scaling through state regulations
Leadership as problem-solving
Staff surveys reveal gaps
Defining the “gray area”
Client connection at scale
Main takeaway: “We agreed on what our gray was.” — Marie Plummer
That’s the difference between having boundaries and actually being able to live with them when real life hits. Most of us try to draw one hard line for every situation—then we either break it, feel guilty, or become rigid and resentful. Defining the gray means you and your leadership team decide, ahead of time, where flexibility is allowed and what factors make it bigger or smaller (staffing levels, capacity, season, client history, real emergencies). It protects your standards and your sanity, because you’re not negotiating from scratch every time something comes up. The goal isn’t to be soft or strict—the goal is to be consistent, human, and sustainable.
About our guests:
Marie and Justin Plummer are the owners of Winston-Salem Dogcare in Winston-Salem, North Carolina. Since launching in 2017, they’ve grown from in-home services into a highly regulated daycare/boarding and in-home care operation, adapting quickly to state and local requirements. They lead a large team while homeschooling their three children, balancing business growth with family priorities. Their approach emphasizes people-first leadership, strong client communication, and building a business that can run well beyond the owners.
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Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed by our guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of Pet Sitter Confessional, its hosts, or sponsors. We interview individuals based on their experience and expertise within the pet care industry. Any statements made outside of this platform, or unrelated to the topic discussed, are solely the responsibility of the guest.
A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE
Provided by otter.ai
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
Pet sitting, business growth, personal touch, employee management, client relationships, regulatory compliance, staff training, problem-solving, business expansion, client retention, staff evaluation, business challenges, work-life balance, professional development, customer service.
SPEAKERS
Collin, Justin P., Marie P.
Collin 00:00
Collin, welcome to pet sitter confessional, an open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter. Today's episode is brought to you by our friends at tie into pet and pet marketing unleashed. How do we manage a growing company, maintain connection with our employees and our clients by keeping that personal touch and maintaining high standards. Today, we're really excited to have Marie and Justin Plummer, owner of Winston, Salem dog care, back on the show. They were previously with us, back on episode 459 and you guys, I'm so excited to bring you back on see how things have changed, and get caught up with you and all these things. So for those who haven't listened to Episode 459, they can go ahead and pause this episode, listen to that one and then jump back in here. But for those who don't have that kind of time, please tell us a little bit more about who you are and a little bit about what
Marie P. 00:53
you do. Ladies, first, we are located in Winston, Salem, North Carolina, which is between Raleigh and Charlotte. We are a, I would have guessed, medium sized city. We started our business, 2014 2017 2017 April 17, 2017 just with me. We were originally in home, and then we started with in client homes. Then we started with in our home, daycare and boarding. And then as time has passed, my husband owned a CrossFit gym. We sold that we were full time in this business with daycare and boarding, we are in home as much as the state of North Carolina will allow us to be. We've had to kind of grow with regulation, which has been fun to say the least. We've grown that aspect, and we've grown our in client home services as well. So we are a dual team business. We've been doing growing this business. We have eight, seven and six year old. We homeschool them. So we have, we have a lot going on on a daily basis, but we are. We're very excited to have the business and the flexibility that it gives us.
Justin P. 02:10
Justin and Marie, we are Justin and Marie, I'm Justin, she's Marie.
Collin 02:17
We'll get T shirts for after this. Marie, you said a phrase that I I can tell, that you both have spent a lot of time thinking about there. You said the phrase you've grown with regulations, or grown within regulations. What is
Speaker 1 02:29
that? What does that meant
Marie P. 02:32
for us? What that has meant is what the Animal Welfare Act in North Carolina, which is very different. I'm hearing from a lot of other people in our networks. We are the Animal Welfare Act dictates everything that we have to check off from our department of agriculture. We are regulated. If you keep a dog in your home for pay at all, you have to have a kennel license from the state. What that meant for us is we actually had to, on very short notice, move from our home to another home in 2021 21 we had to move, get a new home. We had to set it up, re built. We had to build a lot of things to meet their coding. They do not allow wood to be present anywhere. Everything has to be impermeable. So the ability to have dogs in our home home no longer was a possibility unless you live in a commercial kitchen, which we didn't. We also had to be on five acres of land, and we had to be in proper zoning. So basically, our city was great in our our city actually passed some zoning so new people out there, it's important to remember, you have state regulation, you have local regulation, and that can be that can go as far as city and county, and so our county made it illegal to board dogs in your home for pay within the city limits. So that's why we had to move out of the city limits. And what we did is we moved on agriculture zone property based on their recommendations. They were very helpful. Ironically enough, agriculture did not require a special use permit, and what that meant is we didn't have to go in front of a board of people them decide if they thought it was okay for us to have a kennel here, because we live on property that is zoned for animals. We never have to deal with noise violations, they can't call and report us. So they said that was the best place for us to be, because it wasn't subjective, and people couldn't change their mind as to whether we could be here. So what that looked like for us was close to 100 and probably $160,000 investment in just the structure of our home and how things were set up, and our play yards and all of those types of things. They required that we had one traditional kennel. So we had to put in a kennel building. We had a lot of pieces that kind of had to. Moved to get that full license, which we were able to get, we're very glad to have. We were very thankful for our in home side, because while we were shut down, having to redo all of those things, the revenue from that side kept us able to make those changes, stay afloat, keep everybody nice and comfy. We are very glad to live outside the city limits now, because we're on we're on 15 acres, we have a lot of elbow room. The kids love it. Gives us a lot of room. But it was very scary in the beginning, when all of those pieces were changing on us very quickly, without a lot of notice. This has been the first year that we've really kind of felt like we've gotten, or at least, I feel like we've gotten to where it's running. We're not I want to say we were in crisis mode, but we've got the pieces in place. We did everything the Department of Ag asked us to do. We've got all our clients now trained on what that new piece looks like, and both pieces of our business have gotten some fluidity that has been very fun to enjoy this year. They know that we'll pick them up, bring them to daycare and boarding. They know that they could, that we can come in. Everybody's kind of on the same page now, and that really is starting to feel good.
Collin 06:19
Justin, what was that like suddenly changing, like everything you knew about your business model, right, and meeting these new regulations, it sounds like in pretty rapid succession.
Justin P. 06:30
So I'm going to preface this with I think the beauty of I said, obviously, you got a successful podcast here, so you have a lot of different followers, different perspectives. And I think that's the beauty of being husband and wife and two. Being together, you can just view the different perspectives. So I'm gonna say everything she just said, it's in my own words. So looking back over the last, you know, obviously our whole lives, really, everything's always been changing. And you know, one of the beauties of being 40 now, 42 is we have some perspective on the change. Okay? We can look back and evaluate how things have gone and changed in every area of life. So, as she mentioned, you know, she started the business in 2017 and I came on more full board right at the beginning of 2020. Right? So, you know, there was that big life change there. And then, you know, I came in just being able to set some structure and parameters and boundaries around what she had established, like she said, to make it flow smoother and allowed us to better service clients. And then in 2021 when we branched out into having employees, once again, that was just another change and another level up. End of 21 was when we moved so once again, moving homes, and it wasn't really a, yes, it was a change. I wouldn't say it was a change in the business model, because we still did in home, going to clients homes. We still had them coming to us. It's just we now we had a facility to where, you know, we could actually really run the business and have our life in our home, right? So, so once again, there's always change, you know? And she said crisis mode. Actually, I really like that term, because crisis just means change, right? And, you know, I think we can all look back over our lives, over the last, however, every year, and see some change. And I think if you find the most stressed out people in your life, it's because they're trying to not change and just keep it the way it was. But we know that that's been happening, yeah? So now with our new place, we've been here. It'll be four years in December, and it's been super cool, because, like she said, when we initially came in, it was just getting the facility set up, all right, getting it. One of our last home was it was a normal home, you know, normal home, normal neighborhood. It wasn't made for the wear and tear of a dog business, right? Let alone kids in a dog business. So moving here and making the investment to she mentioned all the government kind of land regulations that we had to meet, and then also just building the facility to be able to handle it was super nice, because we knew what we needed. And then kind of once we had a foundation for that, it was then getting people in to work with us. And it's been awesome seeing that growth meaning getting just some employees people to help handle dogs, okay, getting people who had some dog experience coming in to help handle with dogs to now, over the last year, dialing in that administrative level of stuff to where all the back end paperwork and all this department agricultural stuff that they want to see is there, and set we hired an official manager in the last six months or so. I mean, it was somebody who's been with us a year now, so she had some experience with us and previous dog experience. So it's getting, you know, that management layer in, and now it's, you know, at the point of, yes, we're still some hands on with dogs, but we've leveled up to, to now, mostly managing the people, right? You know, that's our main focus. Is some level of helping people. So. Once again, that change, I think, is just, you're always changing. One of the things I keep looking at is, are we dealing with new problems, you know? And and looking at new problems, I'm looking at them as I look at this, and I'm still kind of stressed out. Am I stressed out because it's new? Am I stressed out because it's different. Am I stressed out because of this old feelings of the past that are no longer a concern, right? So is this a new problem? Okay, great. How do we solve it? Let's move on. So, so the understanding everything has changed. It's just, you know what's okay dealing with new problems.
Collin 10:37
Well, so how do you keep track of those new problems and actually start implementing stuff to to get to them and to solve them. Because I know many times I know, like Megan's in my business, it some days just feel like the groundhog day again and again and again. Or sometimes it can feel like, Wait, is this something that needs to be addressed? And how do I actually move forward with this and make real progress on something and know I'm headed in the right direction.
Justin P. 11:05
Okay, all right, so first step to that, you mentioned right direction, you gotta know where you're going and what you want, because we don't know what you want doesn't matter what choices you make, and no matter what direction you're going. So you have to know what you want, right? I know for us, you know, we're headed towards being financially in being financially independent, multi millionaires, all right. So in order to do that, you need assets, you know, things that run smoothly without you being there. All right. So number one, that we know we're going, where the dog, in my opinion, where the, from my perspective, where the dog business comes in with that? Well, the dog business is a vehicle to that, right? So you mentioned, you know, looking at problems and things, and I, like you said, Groundhog Day, right? Just the same bed, boring, repetitive stuff. Well, I've learned that's life. It's a lot of the same, just repetitive, mundane things. We can choose to find joy in them, or choose not to some days, we'll choose to some days we won't, right? So, yeah, there is just a lot of that. And the way that I assess new problems and things to tackle is it's the stuff that we're failing at, right, and failing at multiple times, you know? So if you give me, I can think of a recent example, but it's if something happens once, you know, no big deal. If it happens twice. There may be something there, right? Okay? And three times, for sure. This is a problem that we need to handle. So new problems, I define them where I'm able to recognize them, because it's new areas where we're failing in, or, you know, she's, she's really upset about in some other area of the business, okay, that's a problem we need to solve.
Marie P. 12:42
I'm a lip test in and of itself. You don't have to write me down when we've had something pop up enough, I think I vocalize a little bit more than he does, so it's almost like sandpaper. He when He feel realizes it's stealing enough battery for me, we have to deal with it. The Department of Agriculture, for example, we know when they're coming in for an inspection, they're going to create a groundhog day for us. They're going to pull something out of that magic hat, and we're going to spend some money on it. So we know that one's coming, and then we know that there's a hat that staffing comes out of. You know, when you wake up at six o'clock in the morning and three people called out at 3am there's only one thing you're doing at 3am that would make you need to call out for so we're like, Guess you had a great night. We'll figure it out. So there's the stat patch that the problems generally come out of,
Speaker 1 13:34
and those.
Marie P. 13:35
And I, I You haven't asked this, but I'll go ahead and throw this out there, like the biggest thing that has happened since we spoke to you last I joked you posted something one day on Facebook asking what you'd actually call yourself, and you're not allowed to call yourself a dog walker or dog care or whatever it was you had said, I'm a professional problem solver. I don't know if anybody listening to this is old enough to remember scandal, but I feel like Olivia Pope. I feel like my job is just to solve problems as they come up. I need to do it quickly with character and with standard, and we need to move on from it. And that has been the biggest switch in our business now that we're pushing 45 employees, is that I have to wake up with the expectation that something is going to happen and we have to fix it, not that I'm going to wake up and something is happening to me and I have to react to it. That has been hard. I am not perfect at it yet, but I have found that it keeps me less reactive emotionally, if that makes sense, because we know something's always going to pop up in the staff hat, something's always going to pop up in the Department of Ag hat, and something's always going to pop up in the parenting hat. It's just, and I try not to have, I used to have the like, the shoe is going to drop. What is the shoe? Will the shoe Hurry up and come on, because I need to get on with my day. Yeah.
Collin 14:54
I mean that. That's a very, that's a very fine line. Because, you know, some people can hear like, Oh, I just. Are you walking around all day tense and just like, when's the next thing?
Marie P. 15:06
Yes, I was, I'm not even gonna lie. I don't want people. I want to give people hope, people. Karen, one day was like, Well, I know you have all these automations. Karen, no, we don't. You give us way too much credit. We have ended up with a very large business. We are not nearly set up as well as a lot of companies. Are people who've worked with Michelle. I know they have a rock solid SOP. They've got those awesome back office things. They are measuring every number in their business they can measure. We're not there yet. I almost ashamed to say that we are not but I do want to give people hope that we don't have all of it together, but our business is still very successful, and I hope that that that's hope in and of itself, that you don't have to have it all right, and I'll figure it out to really put in some good numbers and have some good staff
Collin 15:56
well, and to know that you're not, it's not an attitude of, I'm walking around tents waiting for the Next horrible thing to come up, the next fire that I have to pull out. Instead, it's reframing that and going, I am here equipped, ready and able to assist and solve problems. I'm just ready. That's what I'm here for. And it's much more like, I think, embracing that role, as opposed to to fighting it. Kind of keep talking about earlier Justin of like those people who fight the chaos and fight the crisis the most, it's because they're trying to prevent that change. If we walk around tents and and we're we're resentful a lot of those fires and stuff that come up, but if we just kind of go, Hey, here's my station in life, here's how I operate, here's what's required of me, I'm going to step up and I'm going to handle this as I as best I can
Marie P. 16:42
and we, we set out very early on in this, just given our background, I used to be a high school teacher, I used to be a college coach. We, we clearly defined what our expectations were for staff very on or very early on, that we were going to treat them as people, not as owning them. I left teaching because I got tired of having to go into an office and beg someone to be at home with my family when emergencies happened. We are probably way more relaxed than a lot of companies would be. But we said, if they call in and it seems like something it and we're not even going to try to get into the what are they telling the truth? If they call in, they've never taken advantage of it, we're going to say, Okay, if they're like, you know, we had somebody message us yesterday and she's like, I can we we even try to set the table where, when you leave, what is it going to look like? Are you going to ghost us, or are you going to sit down with us and have a conversation? We know this is temporary, so we kind of set that stage just like we had someone yesterday message us, and she's like, I've had this happen with whatever. She had a very serious family emergency. And she's like, I know I'm supposed to call you and we're supposed to talk about this, but I can't talk and not cry. Some people may have said, well, if you can't call us, you're fired, you know? We said, okay, when you get it together, we'll have a conversation. So we that was a piece that we, you know, we we laid out very early. We would treat our staff, and we would take them at their word until we got to a point that we couldn't. We've been very blessed that we haven't, you know, gotten to that point. And the same thing with clients, you know, we, we agreed to have a little He's way better at setting boundaries. I am a feeler. So we had to, we had to sit down and have a powwow. Back to your original question. If we find that it is grading on both of us, or it's grading on the staff, and it comes to us more than to us more than twice. It requires a sit down. So we sat down and said, Okay, we got to set some boundaries. Because you mean, you see it pop up. Everybody asks, What are you doing about cancelation fees? What do you do when people cancel last minute? It's a very big question, and it's been we've set boundaries, we've made a box. We try to keep people in those boxes. But then we agreed what our gray was as far as what we would work with our clients on in that gray area and what things it required. For example, the gray area is bigger when we have 20 staff on that Saturday. If we have staff on that Saturday and we plan to take the kids somewhere that gray area may be a little bit smaller. So we sat down and kind of set those boundaries, and then we set the boundary that we always agreed to be honest. So we'll tell clients, no, we can't take you. Here's what we've got going on. Here's why we can't do it. And just being communicative to them, they are way more open to those types of things when we talk to them and staff, same thing again. We just that people management, we had to define them like Michelle always says. You got to make sure you know what you're doing, where you're doing it. And then Justin was very good at helping us outline that. But at the same time, we didn't let rigidity kill our our return on investment. Estimate for clients, we'd already sowed a lot of time and caring too.
Collin 20:04
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Speaker 2 20:09
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Collin 20:34
If you're looking for new pet setting software in the new year, give time to pet a try. Listeners of our show will say 50% off your first three months by visiting time to bet comm slash confessional. Yeah, that define I love. I think the last time I spoke with you, I ended up writing down about 45 different phrases and things I needed to remember, and we're already up to about 15. Now, this is really, I know you
Justin P. 20:56
agreed on what catch a couple more. Okay, yeah,
Collin 20:59
you agreed on what the gray was. And I like when you said that, my brain just kind of went poof, because we think, we often think of No, where's the line? And what you're saying is no, there is a gradient here. And we all know it's acknowledging. We all know that there's a gradient there, right? We just, we're going to acknowledge that and say, Yes, this is real now. What is it? Hey, look, I can define a little bit within here as well. And sometimes, like you said, sometimes that gray area is a little bit bigger or smaller, depending on how much grace we need to give ourselves and others. And that's just part of that ebb and flow to keep us sane at the end of the day.
Marie P. 21:37
Well, it keeps us married. I am a giver. He is more grounded in in the numbers. I can't operate there as well. I love counting and those types of things, but when it comes to hard lines, he's much better at that. So we found that just identifying that gray area really keeps us from getting like we have a rule that if we want to let a staff member go, specifically in our kennel, because we have a kennel manager, the three of us have to sit down and vote. It's never a hard No, because I used to, I was very definitive. You know, I talked to Robert about, when do you know it's time to go? And he's like, Well, it's time to go. It's time to go. I'm like, Okay, well then I would pull the Collin. The cord before I talk to anybody else, and then everyone else is like, oh my gosh, we got we've got 10 shifts to cover. Now, you know, what are we going to do? So I had to learn that I had to still take input on those things. And so we made a rule that all three it has to be a three way vote before we let anyone go, because we need to make sure that we don't blow everyone else out in the process of fixing that situation. So I've had to learn to not be so authoritative that there has to be a conversation in there. I didn't want to have those things. I just wanted to fix it. So, yeah, I just he's that's how we stay married, is we're talking about it now, versus one of us, quote, unquote, handling it
Collin 23:10
now. I know you've talked a little bit about kind of you know, you've grown immensely. You have the kennel side. You have the in client, home side. How are you both managing those kind of day to day. What does that look like?
Justin P. 23:28
Well, I think she's kind of already answered it at this point. The vast majority of it is, you know, dealing with the people, right? So we have, you know, enough staff to do the clients in home. So how do we best help them, right? And it's that. And then same thing with the kennel, and we have enough staff to care for do all the physical care for the dogs on there. How do we best help them, right? And sometimes it's being a counselor, sometimes it's being a listening ear, sometimes it's being a kick in the pants, you know? Sometimes it's being a therapist, sometimes it's getting in there and being hands on with the with the dogs, right? So it's just, you know, I guess the art part of leadership, I heard it put one time of, how do we, you know, who needs what at that point in time, you know? Yeah, that's
Collin 24:18
Sorry. Go ahead, Maria, Maria,
Marie P. 24:20
we used to bond over the fact with staff that, you know, we're in the trenches with you. We're out here doing it with you. And we had to, we've had to figure out what it looks like and evolve into, you know, like. So we've moved into the staff care side of things, but at the same time, we've had to make sure that we didn't get that appearance of we're leading from the ivory tower, and that we're not getting dirty with them. So that has been a little bit of a learning as we go, kind of thing. And we've had a lot of input from people in all of the groups online, just to kind of help navigate that. But it has been a definite thing of not losing that. That edge used to be real easy when I was like, Dude, I'm out here with you two. I did 20 visits today. You know, they're not seeing us out there, so just making sure that we're still real and that we're still invested, and that has looked more and I got a lot of ideas from Robert, just of ways to make our staff know that we still care about them and we're investing in them.
Collin 25:23
Yeah, I had recently brought on a new team member, and he said one of the reasons he liked working for us is because Megan and I were still doing some of the work, like doing work in the field. And I remember at the time, it just kind of stopped me, because I remember thinking, Ah, but that's not my long term plan, right? So I don't want to be in the field all the time like I am some days.
Speaker 3 25:47
So is that so, you know, it got me
Collin 25:51
worried, because all of a sudden I was like, Well, if that's the only reason ever, you know, other people are here is because they're like, Oh, well, you know, the owners are out here doing this. They feel that camaraderie, and if I start to pull ourselves out. It did become a real concern for Megan and I to start going, Okay, we need to start also just, I think, redefining that relationship like with with our employees, of what the expectation actually is.
Marie P. 26:15
And we did the evaluation process like I know Michelle talks about it. I think Robert does too, as well Janie did with the MBA when I did her program, we did that staff survey, and I think we talked about this last time. We're pushing probably between 40 and 45 staff. Now we never intended to have so many full time people, but people are starting with us. They fall in love with what they're doing. They say that they like us and they want to pick up those hours. Well, we put this survey out on how we were doing, and we found out that there was that disconnect. We had gone from being in the field to not being in the field, and they felt it. And the other thing that we had never really considered, and I should have known better, I mean, I trained all the health and PE teachers in the county that I was in. Professional development was what I did. They wanted professional development. They wanted more than what we were doing, and it had and we were doing things to keep our staff trained, but we didn't realize the level they wanted it on, because they were seeing it as their profession, and we hadn't quite switched our mind to take that whole image in. And so those staff surveys showed us those two big things that they were willing to invest on that level, and they wanted us to treat them that way. And so there was a big shift there for us, and kind of how we move through the rest of this season, and and making sure that we we stepped our game up. From an employer standpoint, just kind of hit me. I was like, I don't have a lot of people working part time for us. Like we have people that plan do this for a long time. We got to make sure we got this right. And it really kind of, there was a panic moment, and there was a fire under my butt lit at the same moment. And I was like, Oh my gosh. And, and I don't know, maybe other people have a more solid opinion of this, but I don't know. I never woke up one morning and thought, wow, we have a real business, like I still, sometimes I look at what we're doing and I hear numbers that other businesses are running. And I didn't realize that we had such a big business, because we're not in an office every day. We don't see them. We've gotten our processes pretty nailed down, so the machine runs pretty well without us, you know, being involved in it every day. You know, 24/7, but I just, I had not I'm so glad we did those surveys, because it showed us very quickly that we needed to posture better for our staff, that they were seeing us as their long term game plan. And I was like, Wow, that's some responsibility, man. I think we have 10 single moms working with us right now, like so you know, payroll can't be late. We got to make sure that these clients are here for them and that their their schedule fills up. One thing we had to learn to navigate that never crossed my mind. What do I do with people when they get an injury that's not work related, but they're on limited duty? How do we make that work? We're still trying to figure out what our team lead management office kind of looks like, but what we have found this is just us, is that people inside our business run our office better than people that we bring in. I don't know if that's because I need to get better at training people that don't have pet care experience, but we have found that it has just been smoother, more efficient, quicker and just better quality in our business. And so we're still trying to figure out now that we have these long term people, these types of things sneak up. And so how can we make those moments work out for everyone? We keep them paid, we get the office work taken care of, or we improve on something, and then just being able to kind of hand things off. Um. So you can't say enough for giving those staff evaluations. It's scary when you send them out, because you're like, who's going to come out of the woodworks and be like, You're the worst boss ever.
Speaker 4 30:10
You know, never had that happen, but you're putting
Marie P. 30:15
yourself out there, and you're very exposed, and it is scary, but that was huge for us well.
Collin 30:22
And earlier, Justin, you had talked about then, like, you get this information, and then you you have to figure out what you do with it. Of like, do I need to be the encourager? Do I need to do a kick in the pants? Do I need to do this walk us through how you handle knowing, like, what to engage? Because I asked this, because a lot of people who bring on team members, they bring employees, they can appear to be very one sided, or, like, like, very, not one one dimensional of, well, I just need to be boss. That's what I need to be, and I need to just say what to do. But you're bringing in a lot more, you know, complexity to this that I think, I don't think a lot of people really appreciate about what they're stepping into in that role.
Justin P. 31:03
Okay, well, I'll give you some background on me, and this may answer your question, and it may just frustrate some people, because we all have different backgrounds. Let me ramble long enough and I'll bring it together with something solid. So you mentioned boss. You said my goal was, never said I'd be anybody's boss. And really, when I once I had been in business long enough, I look back and see the few jobs I had growing up and never really had a boss, right? That whole corporate employee life was nothing that was ever been a part of my life. You know, I had a few jobs in high school and college, and then in college is when I first started my first business, and, you know, never was bad, so that whole boss concept, it was just never really in my brain. So that's first thing. When I was very young, I was blessed to get hooked up with some people who could coach and mentor me on business finances and a lot of different areas, and they just taught me leadership. So those principles was all I ever really knew. And then we get to this point now, yes, we're their boss by you know, where our position is in the pyramid structure, we're still just leaders. You know, every everybody's a leader, and it starts with you, if you can't lead yourself, and you definitely can't lead others. And once again, kind of now, being 42 I can look back over the last, you know, 20 years and see that now that we've been blessed with people to help, to help them, I just talk about when I had that issue, what I did to overcome it, give them a resource or two, or Some things that helped me in that particular area, right? There is no hard or fast rule of, you know, always do this with this person, right? You know, I mentioned the kick in the pants, you know, do some do some groundwork, or do some hands on, work with them. Or, you know, personal improvement plans for people, there's no hard and fast way. Know, what's the best option at that time when we see people have real issues? So I guess I give you a real example. So we have one employee working with us. She's pregnant now, and so she's first, first, first baby. She's early 20s, like 24 right in there, 25 so if you've ladies, have you ever been pregnant, especially first time, you know how that goes. And guys, have you ever been around pregnant? Ladies, you know how that goes? Remember her, you know, working, doing the dog stuff while she was pregnant. And, you know, pregnancy brain, she taught me, is a very real thing, right? So we had this one lady, and over a few weeks, a couple different things with with clients and dogs came up. Nothing major, nothing egregious, but they came up. And we've learned that for people who have been with us a long time, long time, probably six months or more, and we start seeing just issues with clients, whether it's whether it's the Walker's fault or not. We know that is a pattern that leads to someone who's mentally checked out of the job, and it's time for them to move on. Right? So I called this I call this lady. I said, Hey, you know this client can send a message about this. We've noticed these three or four things now, over the past two weeks, we talked about them. They're still continuing, and I had to let her know, hey, this is the pattern we see of people who are who are who are no longer gonna be working with us soon, whether they leave or get fired. The point is, they're not gonna be working with us soon, when we see these. So I brought that to her attention. We talked about it, and she just said, just with the pregnancy and the other personal things, you know, it's kind of too much in her head, so we talked about just reducing her hours a little bit to see how that levels things out over the next little bit. So that's our recent example. There a conversation is always kind of first go to when. And people, when you're not face to face with them, asking them questions, hey, what's going on?
Marie P. 35:07
That's the biggest thing. Is asking first before you go in and hit it with the we do. We do have a system that is numerically weighted so that it's not objectionable, as far as to keep us honest. Because again, obviously, I'm sure you've gathered we're feelers, so we had to create a number system to make sure that we measured what we were doing and kept up with where staff were kind of ranking with those things that pop up. Because if you don't write them down, what we found out is a lot more things are popping up that are red flagging. You're just not remembering them. It's easy when I had five or six employees, but when you start getting to 40, and then you start going, like, I'll sit down and talk with my Collin or so, don't you remember such and such? I'm like, that was them. And she's like, Yeah. And so we had to sit down and make sure that we were documented and giving a numerical weight to I don't want to call infractions, whatever you want to call them, whatever, title things that red flag, so that we know when we're starting to move down that continuum. What we did do is give a year reset, so that we're not holding on to things for like, a really long period of time, which it's fine to do. We just for us, didn't feel like that was a great fit, but Justin taught me, you got to ask first before you go in there thinking, you know what's going on. And the other piece of that, when he sat down with our staffer is, you know, he just didn't just say we're going to cut your hours so you can get your head right. It was, how much can we cut your hours to make sure you still make enough money, but you're not stressed out. What can we do to move these pieces to work for you? Do we need it? We even talked about starting her later, so that you know she could get get over those morning hormones, because they are real, and they make you feel like crap, and it's just hard, and so just again, having the numbers to fall back on because, yes, we are business owners. We cannot feel our way through everything. When it comes to workers comp claims, you have to document that you've done five or more things to correct whatever is happening. Otherwise you're probably going to be liable for paying them after they leave. You can't just let people go. We talk about in these groups all the time that a lot of states are at will. You just let people go, yes, but that doesn't mean there aren't consequences for you as a business owner. So we still have to have that, those records, the posture in the background, but we've just tried really hard to not let that take away the human element. So finding a way to balance the safety of of our business, but the lives of our, of our, of our staff. And I wish that there was this Blueprint we could all print out and we could just follow it. You just kind of have to figure out where your personality and your mental safety fall in that continuum. Some people, I'm sure, have to stay closer to the numbers. If I didn't have Justin, and it was just me running my business, I imagine that I may have to lean heavier on what my paper says and take the feeling out because I don't have someone to back me up. People that have someone like Justin, or you have a very developed back office, you may be able to be a little bit more lenient again on if that falls in those gray areas you define them, but figure out. I know burnout is so real in any any industry, but I think more so here, because our phones can ring non stop. So just finding where you can set those boundaries, but I strongly recommend anyone set those boundaries based off of one what protects your business because it is your asset, but what also protects the most valuable thing we have in our we bought a bit another dog walking business back in October that was here in Winston, and the biggest asset that they had was their staff. It was the staff we were looking at experience already in the system, already using time to pet all of those things people do have a price tag attached to them, so they need to go into how you evaluate your business.
Justin P. 39:12
And you said one thing people looking for for something to make it less complicated. And if you want it to be less complicated, deal only with dogs and not with people. If you have people, it's going to be more complicated than you want it to be, right? Yeah, but welcome to Life, right? You know, a couple of things you said is really well, and this is something I always go back and forth with a lot, is, am I feeling out of sorts, mad or upset, because I have an improper expectation, you know, and you can, you've mentioned a couple of things, couple areas to where, you know, you tell people, if I just get this right, if I just get this done, when you get done, then what? Everything will always go smooth, forever, the way that you always want
Collin 39:56
it, I'll be obviously, obviously, yeah.
Justin P. 40:00
You touch it once. Yes, and you and everybody else in the graveyard can enjoy that life, but there's nobody walking around on planet Earth to where that exists. So, you know, the problems, the fires, the things I've and I have to, always have to remind myself this, that's just called life. Now we don't have any of those things to deal with anymore. Then you are dead, right? And it's like, you know, 10% is really horrible, 10% is really phenomenal. And there's an 80 necklace, 80% to where you can choose how you know, how you're gonna feel about it, you know. And you mentioned walking around with it. And I find myself that way sometimes, that because, yes, something is going to come up that I have to handle and
Marie P. 40:41
deal with. There was actually a period of time when we there was, like, a couple month window when we looked at each other and we're like, we're supposed to be wound up right now. And he's like, I know it's like, we feel like we got it, like we were in this we got to do something mode, and we were like, I feel like we should be handling something. And there really wasn't, because we had gotten those processes better. They don't always go away, but they're there. I want people know there is that window where you like you kind of catch yourself like I should be knotted up right now, and I'm not. And we add that we actually had to verbalize it to each other. And there's been a couple of times where we had to look at each other and say, We don't have to feel like this right now. Things are actually really good when you're when you're in the trenches, getting the ball rolling it. I mean, it takes a lot of sweat, and a lot of you have to do a lot of and I feel like there's, there's a little bit of that at every phase of business, every phase of growth. And I'm sure, you know, we've been very blessed. We haven't ever had a period where we've gone backwards to this point. So you're as a good business owner, I don't think there's any point that you ever really can just check out and not think about it. But I will say, what's been so nice now that we do have a lot of these things in place, I have the energy again to think and be creative, and that really makes you fall in love with your business again, when you get to actually think about where it's going, how you can help other people. We've had money now where we can, like, sponsor things. And when the shelter posts, hey, we need whatever, I just Instacart it to them. I'm like, let's just, you know, get it to you. It's just nice to be able to to have that flexibility, and it was well worth the cuts, the scars, the bleeding that we had to do early on to be where we are now, I would do it again.
Collin 42:29
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Collin 43:17
and use the code PSC 15. That's PSC, 15 to get 15% off your website. Template designed from our friends, pet marketing, unlinked. That's a important perspective to have on that growth, I think. And you mentioned that like we you can look at what you're currently handling and go, huh? Because I know for Megan and I will go, man, if we were tackling what we're doing today, if we were doing that two years ago, I would have been on a puddle of panic in the floor, like I would have just been completely melted. No idea what's going on. And part of it is, like growing up as a person. I think that's a big part, too, of like, oh, I can't actually handle this. A lot of it, though, is all of this background stuff, where the pain that I experienced two years ago, and I sat down and I went, I will never go through that again. And I put in a policy or procedure, I did something in something you're talking about Maria, like reaping the rewards years down the line of that stuff that you sowed way back when. And so how, how easy it is sometimes to forget about that, and really the blessings that that brings to us. And I know
Marie P. 44:27
people tell you, don't look back. You got to keep looking forward. Like I always enjoy sitting down with you, because you make us look back at things that we had totally forgotten about. But I think there's something to be said. I agree with you that we need to look back and just while we've come along, because the person that I was even three months ago, we have a new kennel manager. She's been with us for a long time, and I've not always been a people person. I've had to learn chat. GBT is one of the best tools I have in my business, not even for like prompts. Robert's probably gonna laugh when he hears this, but I. I take what I am fixing to go say to someone, and I run it through chat. GBT, I'm like, I have this staffer. I've got this issue. I need you to make me relatable. I need you to even tell Chad. GBT, I'm gonna tell you how angry I am, and then I need you to back it back.
Speaker 1 45:15
It's like my therapist just being able to tell it. I cannot believe they did this. And then.
Marie P. 45:21
But how do I respond to this appropriately as an employer, it has saved my life. I have told my husband I am so glad that I was born right now. I'm glad I'm a Pinterest mom, because I don't have to reinvent the wheel. And I am so glad that I have chat GBT, because it will help me my one of my office members like you. She goes, did you post that before? After you ran it through chat, GBT, and after she said that, like twice, I was like, I'm running everything through chat. GBT, before I even talk to people. If I do a pip, I even sit down with a what bullet point should I, you know, stick to? What should I avoid? It also helps you with legality. But I was like, I'm just so glad that I have this, because otherwise I would just probably be doing some dumb stuff, but my kennel manager is going through all of the same things with learning how, because I'm a perfectionist, so I was in this whole you didn't do that, right? You got to get this better. If this isn't clean, I missed the other 475,000 things that my kennel staff had nailed and it it puts them on the fence, yeah, and they don't feel appreciated. So I had to go through that whole thing. And then when my kennel manager first started learning how to manage people, same thing, and I just sat her down. I said, I just wanna give you a hug. I said, because I know exactly where you are right now, and I'll tell you what, in three months, we're gonna sit down and you're gonna go, Oh my gosh. I am so glad we're through that I had because, I mean, she was just frustrated because she's like, No one feel like, no one likes me. Oh, it wasn't that at all. Once, I told her, You go say thank you for this. Let's talk to them. Sit them down. I gave her some money. I said, take everybody to lunch once. Take everybody lunch, one on one, take everybody out. Just go sit down, talk with them. Next thing I know, everybody's like, change the whole mood of the kennel. We had one bad person. We cleared that out. Next thing you know, I mean, it's like a bouquet of flowers down there. They're all hanging out. They're all loving each other. And just to be because I wanted to pull my eyes out, I told my husband, I said some mean things to my husband during this whole process, probably to the kids too, but just coming out on the other end and now being able to see, oh, hey, she's in the same spot I'm in. Girl, I did the same thing. Here's what you do, here's my recommendation, here's some things to read. This will help you. And she's just like, Oh my gosh. And it's just been fun to actually get through what were probably some of my darkest days, questioning who I am as a human being, and seeing her grow now, and just how they're all kicking in behind her. It's just really it makes it worth it, and you can't do this and not grow as a person. Yeah, I know everybody knows that person. They just look. They just look they just sit there like we're not gonna say anything, but it's like you are still doing the same thing that you were doing six months ago. Nothing's going to change. That's the other thing I've learned is that people who aren't open to listening to things, you can tell them till you're blue in the face. So that whole you guess you can't lead a horse to water. Lead them to water. We can't make them drink. I've learned to be more reserved with my energy.
Justin P. 48:25
But you can put salt in their oats. I learned that, no,
Collin 48:29
I don't. Is that? Is that euphemism, or what does that stand for?
Justin P. 48:33
They eat their oats and they drink and they eat like salt and they're thirsty.
Collin 48:36
It's like the peanuts at the bar, right? Okay, cool.
Justin P. 48:40
Learn something new every day. My therapist taught me that.
Collin 48:42
Okay, so find the salt right? Sometimes we got to be that salt. I guess we've talked a lot about your team, and I was interested from the client perspective, because you both have talked about the immense growth that you've had an expansion and to buying another business and bringing a bunch of stuff in. For a lot of people who get into this industry, they love that personal connection they have with their clients. And it's kind of that relationship that they have with them from from your perspective. I mean, first off, was that something you wanted to preserve, tried to preserve, or How has that worked with you, and as you've grown and added clients that I'm sure many which you've never seen or barely even talked
Marie P. 49:26
to at this point. So we were because of the marketing and advertising that we had done before we got into this business. We knew we wanted to be more personable than most companies would want to be, because everything we had read, every mentor, every conference we had gone to, had just talked so much about how you can do the nuts and bolts right all day long, but your retention rates are going to be higher if they feel the connection personally to you. Like, our meet and greets will sometimes go longer than we really want them to go. But if they want to sit there and show us their like, we have some phenomenal clients. If they want to show us their artwork, we're going to look at it at the meet and greet. It might cost us some money, some time. Time is money. I totally get that. But when we know that the two year ROI is somewhere between four and $6,000 I can listen to some artwork. I mean, I can look at it, I can hear some stories about and we see their life happen. And so it just kind of helps build we have a proverbial fuel tank. Is what we teach our staff. We are trying to make sure that we do enough good things to keep that tank full, so that when the one bad thing happens, they're like, that's all right, I know then their heart's in the right place. They didn't mean to leave the door unlocked, whatever, whatever the case may be, we still take, we do do form fills off of our website, but we we've actually picked up quite a few clients from other companies. Some people love it. When you just have, you go on, you do a link, the link makes you an appointment. Someone shows up at your house three days later. But we've had a lot of people that have gotten turned off by that. So we have, I feel like we have such long term clients because we still answer the phone when they call. We do get the FORM FILL offline, but they talk to us. We anyone that I can get on the phone with me. I want them on the phone with me. I want them on the phone with my managers, because we will talk to them as a person and look at their family collectively, and it gives us an opportunity to really let them know what we do, because we are a unicorn. We do in home and we do daycare boarding when there is an issue. Our goal is to always get them on the phone within an hour of something happening. Their dog gets sick, even if it's not our fault, per se, if there is an event that flags. We want to have them on the phone, or we want them to see our phone number in their caller ID, so that they can say, You know what they were trying to handle that as soon as it happened. We don't want there to ever be that, that that break in communication. We don't have a lot of automations. We try to to still give that communication. Do we have clients that we will schedule for them? Collin, yes, we do. Collin, does it drive me nuts? Yes, but I have, I have a client who has been with us through the loss of her husband. She now has cancer. She's on chemo. She can't keep it straight when she books. What does she message us and change her visit probably five times a week, yes, but the woman is on stinking chemo. She and these two loved each other in a way. I cannot describe this man like served in the military. So do we both look at each other and we're like, oh my gosh, like, Duh. But we do that for her, because she's she's a wonderful woman. She's going through a ton, and she's probably sent us 15 clients. Most companies don't want to do that, and that is okay, but we have found that just handling that each week for her, we don't know how long she'll be here. We just feel like it's the human and decent thing to do. We are in a position that we can do it and it doesn't cause a collapse in our front office gray area. We will continue to do it for her, because it's fitting in the gray area. We're still staying outside on the fringe. We'll continue to do that we we love the fact that our business, and really all of us have the opportunity to high tech our business. Not everyone understands the nuances to time, to pet which is the app that we use? We use the facility side. It is newer, lots and lots of glitches. They will change things. They don't tell us that. They change it. That's another hat. Collin, I want to put that in there. We've got the app of things that get changed in the app, and we just don't get told so we know that those things are coming, we're not going to find out about them, and then we have to call and figure out what's going on. So we then have to educate our clients, as well as our staff, on how to navigate the workarounds that have been created an 80 year old grandma, or even some some 65 year old people just can't navigate the app. So we don't want to lose and we've even had, we've gotten clients from other companies because they require lock boxes, but don't sell them at the meet and greet. You best believe every single one of my managers has a box of lock boxes in the back of their car. I'm not going to lose a client because they're a surgeon. They work, you know, 18 hours a day, and don't have time to go to Ace Hardware to buy a lock box. Problem solving, again, you know, we don't live and die by the requirements. That does take some time. It probably does cost. Us some money. When you look at what what the hourly rates are, our staff will sometimes run over. If you're spending $15,000 in my business a year, and you run over for five minutes, because whatever happened, we're not going to charge you for it. We're going to eat it. It's an investment. I feel like it all comes out in the wash, and as long as we get there, may come a point, we may just not be big enough that we have to shrink our gray box. But if we get to that point, we'll we'll sit down, we'll talk about it, we'll manage it then. But right now, I feel like we are not perfect. We don't always do things right, but putting that little bit of extra time in to be more hands on. We feel like protects our ROI, not to mention, I mean, I have some, we have, we just have some fantastic clients. We still have never done a big marketing campaign. We haven't had to. I mean, we are growing at 30% off of word of mouth T shirts and car magnets on cars. So we just, and some people that is not their box of salt. There are a lot of introverts that don't want to talk to people. That's fine. I don't mind. So we just, we keep finding people that can help generate that because it's just easy. We've not, I'm not the person to get on here for marketing campaigns, because I just don't know them yet. We haven't had to do them. But I really think it just comes down to the fact that we are spending a little bit more hands on time with with clients, and we we help them. We don't just send them an email that says, right now, what we're battling is being able to book daycare on the facility side of time to pet is disappearing randomly for certain clients. And if I had just been sending them a message that said, here's the steps for time to pet, how to book daycare, book it, we wouldn't have known it was an issue, and I could have lost 1520, clients. So I think there is a lesson in that too, is you can't always assume that they're just messing it up, and by slowing down and taking that extra couple of minutes to walk them through it, we have found that not everything is always solid in apps tech, tech can be wonky.
Collin 57:12
Well, I'll give you a great example. We had a client who, sorry, go ahead.
Justin P. 57:17
Justin say, if you don't know computers messed up, then you've never, you never used one. But go ahead. No.
Collin 57:21
Well, on the technology side, we had a client who reached out to us who was legally blind and wanting to book through our services legal. And I'm going, Yeah, I'm going, like, Oh, here's the how to book process. Here's the how to book process. Do you want to know what the accessibility feature does to the application and the software that in our website? No, it is. It doesn't follow those steps. It turns out, right? It's hard to work through those things, and all of a sudden I'm sitting here going, like, oh, okay, right. Like, don't know what this is like. So on the on the chat with tech support, trying to figure out what this actually does, so that I know, so I can give help and assistance, and then realizing at the end, going, I think this will be that gray area where we're going to book we're going to book these until we can get a better solution or get something figured out. We'll book these. That's okay. We'll take that on. And that does go against those you know, the industry advice, right? Of like, no box, box, box, box. And I see Justin, you're kind of like, I could see you've got the thoughts on this.
Justin P. 58:21
Oh no, I'm sound with you. Yeah, the one, the one blind guy who calls a year, you can book his appointments for sure it's going to be okay.
Marie P. 58:32
You learn him to know him. You know that he books every Monday through Friday. Well, then Collin, he likes you, then he's open to, Hey, can I set you up on a template? If you need to cancel, just call me. You can always work your way out of it. Doesn't always have to stay so hands on, but you got to get enough fuel on the tank for them to trust you, to work them through the process. And we've even had people who think they can't use the app. They fall in love with the report cards, and they want to be on there so fast and not have to wait for that email there. There was one lady I even I was on my way home. I don't recommend this for everyone. I just happened to not have the kids that day. She was older. Was so frustrated with the app. She's like, I can't figure out how to get this thing on. We have a meet and greet for like, four days, and she could you just tell she was a very organized person. And I said, You know what? I said, Would it be weird for you? I said, I just pulled I pulled over. I pulled her address up. I was three blocks from her house. Said, how about I just come over? I'll download this app for you. I'll get you logged in. You do that said, not for everyone, but I've just enjoyed being on the phone with you, and I could tell she she was about five seconds away from saying I don't like your business because the app is too hard to understand. No, we're not going to do that. The app is not my business. The app is a tool that we use in our business. We are what make my staff are amazing. I tell everyone that my staff will figure. This out for you. We've even started telling people don't get frustrated with it when you come to daycare and boarding. If you need us to walk you through it, we will. I think we, I think some people can get so wrapped up in that the app is their business. It's not, it's not the magic sauce. And so I went over there lady, get in the app. She's wonderful. Looks every week. It was, you know, spare of the moment, last minute I want the cleaners had just come. We have a cleaner. They come once a month. It is the most relaxing 30 minutes of my day before the kids get home. I have 30 minutes on my schedule self care to come sit in my on my couch and enjoy my clean house. I gave up that 30 minutes to go help that lady. She ended up being wonderful. I'm glad that I did it. You can't always do that. You can't do it every time, but we could, and we did it, and I'm glad that we did great area. It fit that day. I could put it in the box. We did it, and it was way better than me having to all and honestly, probably Collin save some time, because I didn't have to do 50 more phone calls, 37 messages of her trying to fix it. It was done. She saw
Speaker 1 1:01:03
me, instant rapport. Yeah. And I
Justin P. 1:01:07
would say you mentioned that kind of when you started this question is new people feel they have to have that personal relationship and connection? You know? She said we a lot. We is not this face or this face, it's Winston Salem dog care, and yes, at the beginning, it's really maybe the one face, but that's something you have to grow out of. You know, I think, you know, thinking you have to be the one in everybody's face all the time for my lack of better terms is like an immature way to look at it. You know, people, once their relationship has been established, whether that's with us personally, and then to the business, we're always building to the business and the team when we when we meet somebody, but you know, once again, a very small perception of relationships. Because, you know, we're all on Facebook social media. How many friends do you have on there who you feel you have a relationship with you haven't actually physically seen in decades? So that relationship changes over time, but as long as you keep providing the good service, when you do see someone face to face, if it is once a year, taking that extra time to talk back with them, catch up with them, you know, is the next level of, you know, more mature, I guess, the next level of relationships, right? We still
Marie P. 1:02:15
send handwritten birthday cards. It takes time. It is monotonous. It is not fun. But I get so many phone calls from clients. My kids were so excited they got real mail in the mail. It wasn't junk mail. We partnered with a pet store here, and she makes a special cookie for our clients. If they come in for their birthday, they get a birthday cookie. And we also have gotcha Day cards that go out through all the rescues, when dogs get adopted, to go into this to go check out this pet store. We love this pet store. They're all human, grade, quality food. It's wonderful. We get to, you know, network with someone else, but they get so excited because there's something tangible for them to go out and do again. We don't have time to do it, but the clients love it. It builds that rapport. And you know, then she's going in and talking, they're going in and talking to the pet store owners, and she's like, you know, the things that we're saying, we want them to be saying those things we want they know my kids, they want to know what's going on. It just it creates that connection. And like I said, everyone and everything we've read said those connections, you can't put $1 amount on them, and I really think that's what's keeping our growth just like so we've been 20 to 30% since we started, and I really think it's just the people. There are some people that are easier to deal with than others, but you know, it's still better than dealing with a classroom of 45 kids who don't be there and don't like me.
Speaker 1 1:03:49
We just, we just, we just take it well.
Collin 1:03:53
Marie Justin, I want to thank you both so much for coming on the show today and encouraging us to humanize our businesses and focus on the people and those relationships and that it's possible at any scale, and that's something that's really well worth it in the long run, when we want to have a business that we're proud of and that other people want to be a part of, too. I know there's a lot going on. You guys are always on to another other projects and things like that. So if people want to follow along, get connected with you and see all the cool stuff that you're doing. How best can they do that?
Justin P. 1:04:24
So with our website, www.ws, dog care.com,
Marie P. 1:04:30
social media. Stuff is Winston Salem, dog care and people. I'm in the next level group. I'm also in the pet bus or confessionals. If anybody has any questions, I don't, we don't pretend to know it all I can, you know, give people perspective. If they're interested in the perspective that we have, they're more than welcome to DM us from either of our social media accounts. I'll help in any way I can. I really want people to just be able to find the joy in their business. If they've lost it, they get stuck. I mean, I know the answer is. But I've met so many you, included just wonderful people that I can push in their direction so they feel free to reach out if they they need to talk to us. Awesome.
Collin 1:05:10
Well, I'll have those links in the show notes. Thank you guys so much for coming on. I know you've got a lot on your plate. Really means a lot that you'd spend some time with
Speaker 1 1:05:18
us today. Thank you. Thank you for having us. Thank you for having us.
Collin 1:05:21
My favorite part of my conversation with Marie and Justin, besides being all of it was when Marie said we agreed on what our gray was. We agreed on what our gray was. There's actually a difference between having boundaries and being able to live with them when life hits, because we don't exist and live in a vacuum. Most of us, if you're like me, try and draw that hard line for every single situation, then we either break it, feel guilty or become rigid and resentful. Defining the gray means that you and your leadership team and your your everybody around you, decide ahead of time where the flexibility is allowed and what factors make that area bigger or smaller, whether that's just your capacity or the season that you're going through, or client history or Real Life emergencies or staffing, whatever that is, this ultimately protects your standards, and, importantly, your sanity, because you're not negotiating from scratch every single time that something comes up. The goal isn't to be soft. Goal isn't to be strict. The goal is to be consistent, human and sustainable. We want to thank our friends at time to pet and pet marketing Unleashed for making this show possible, and we really want to thank you so much for listening. We hope you have a wonderful rest of your week, and we'll be back again soon. You you.
