Dec 8

Dec 8 238: Making a Difference with Shelly Ross

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Summary:

How do you make a difference in the world? Each time you care for a pet, you are an integral part of their and their owner's lives. Shelly Ross is in the business of giving peace of mind to her clients by providing cat care to the San Francisco area for the past 18 years. What started out as an interim job until she could find "real work", her business Tales of the Kitty has turned into a true passion project. Shelly shares her advice for building trust with clients and why treating your staff well is just a no brainer. She also discusses disaster planning as a pet business and how to cope with the emotions that come with being a business owner.

Topics on this episode:

Disaster planning
Why she is cat only
Building Trust
Emotions of a business owner
Treating clients well

Main take away? Your services allow people to live their lives and have confidence their pets are being cared for.

About our guest:

After 15+ years in Corporate America, Shelly leapt at the opportunity to be laid off. Even in 2003 the cost of living in San Francisco was excessive and without a severance package she never would have dared to take a chance and start her own business. She was cat-only from the start and thought she would do it for a year, while figuring out what she wanted to do next. That was 18 years ago and her "little" business has grown to 15 employees and is still going strong!

Links:

Email Shelly: Shelly@talesofthekitty.com

Her website: https://talesofthekitty.com

Give us a call! (636) 364-8260

Subscribe on iTunes, Spotify, Google, Stitcher, & TuneIn

Email us at: feedback@petsitterconfessional.com

**A VERY ROUGH TRANSCRIPT OF THE EPISODE**

Provided by otter.ai

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

cat, people, business, clients, employees, work, pet, visit, shutdown, care, relationships, sitters, person, knowing, san francisco, job, talking, staff member, pet sitters, trust

SPEAKERS

Collin, Shelly R.

00:17

Hi, I'm Meghan. I'm Collin. And this is Pet Sitter confessional, and open and honest discussion about life as a pet sitter. Today's episode is brought to you by time to pet and pet sitters International.

Collin 00:30

Most of us don't look forward to the possibility of being laid off. But in 2003, Shelly Ross leapt at the opportunity to leave her job at the Federal Bank and go head on into running her full time petsitting business tails of the kitty was born that year. And all these years later, Shelly is still passionate about giving care for cats in the San Francisco area. She joins us today to talk about the core values that led her to make that leap. What it's like running her business with her staff and a little bit of disaster planning thrown in there. Let's get started.

Shelly R. 01:02

I'm Shelly Ross. And I have a corporate America background until 2003. When the group that I was in I worked for the Federal Reserve Bank and my department needed to reduce headcount by one and I had been, I had done that typical thing where you have a pet sitter and you're like, if you ever need help, let me know. And I had started helping my pet sitter. And so they said, We need to reduce headcount. And I said, lay me off, give me a severance package, because out here in San Francisco, you can't be without a job. Even back in 2003, the cost of living was crazy compared to everywhere else. So I got a severance package. And that gave me what I needed to get this going. And here I am. 18 years later, still at it,

Collin 01:43

you came out of banking. How do you think that that influences how you run your business and how you manage

Shelly R. 01:49

it? I've always looked at it as a business. I came at it from a business perspective, I was really involved in y2k planning and disaster planning. So I had a disaster plan, which seems to impress a lot of people, but it's like we live in San Francisco, we have to worry about earthquakes. So I've had a disaster plan. Right from the very beginning, I had insurance from the beginning, I just looked at it as a business rather than, you know, a hobby or something that just evolved from something else.

Collin 02:13

Disaster Planning. I think that that's something that not a lot of people really put a lot of thought into. Because I mean, what's the worst that could happen? So when you when you when you sit down and you think through that process, what's what's what's going through your head, and what should other people be taking into account?

Shelly R. 02:28

I made a point of limiting my service area, to a geographic region where we could get to every client on foot, if need be. So people asked me a lot of times, why don't I go to Marin? Why don't I go out to this part of town? Why don't I go there. And it's like, because if something happens, I need to make sure I can get there or, you know, my people can get there. And even though San Francisco's only seven miles by seven miles, it can take me 45 minutes to drive four miles. So I ride a bike as well. And I've got one employee who's on a scooter. So we just needed to keep it to a size where we knew we could get to everybody like we would never expand to the East Bay, because we couldn't get across the bridge to get into the East Bay if that was necessary. I think I think it's important to think about that. It's like if you have blizzards or you live somewhere where they're tornadoes or buyers, you need to make sure that you haven't spread yourself out so far that if something happens, you can't get where you need to be. I don't think I mean, we all have emergency contacts, but I don't look at those as a backup for petsitting. If like I would never call an emergency contact and say we can't get there. Can you send? You know, can you go in and take care of this cat, we've agreed to do the job. And it's our responsibility to make sure it gets done.

Collin 03:46

I think the disaster planning it does take time. And I think to think about through like, what are your processes, but also like what's what's endemic to where you are you concerned to things about like earthquakes and other people are concerned about blizzards or tornadoes or hurricanes, and then prepare for that. Obviously, we can't be prepared for everything. But actually just going through that process of thinking through what could go wrong. Really, just that process alone really sets us up for success. If something does happen.

Shelly R. 04:12

Yes, it does. Like out here, we had a bunch of flooding. And people were out, you know, up to their waist walking through water to get where they needed to go. So you just you kind of have to think outside the box because things you think would never happen. Now it's getting to the point with climate change and everything that the unthinkable is now thinkable. You

Collin 04:33

have several staff members as well. So what's it like getting that into their heads and training them on the preparedness that kind of sounds like it comes second nature to you.

Shelly R. 04:41

They all cover a smaller region. Each of my employees covers a set area and the ones that are on foot, it all has to be someplace that they can get to within 15 minutes. So we don't have we try not to have them have to commute whether it's by car or foot or by more than 15 minutes to get to Any visit, and I knew they all live here in San Francisco. So they know if something happens, we have to get there. It's in our manual there drilled into them during training. Fortunately, we haven't had anything like that knock on wood,

Collin 05:10

you have had a long history with pets, and you've had a few really impactful pets in your life over time. So I'd love to hear about who they were and how they've impacted you and how you approach pet care.

Shelly R. 05:22

The whole start of it was a cat named midnight, I was eight years old, and we moved into a new house and the people that had owned the house, they moved pretty far away. I don't remember how far it was. But it was a significant difference in the cat came back. And midnight was an all black male cat hated my dad. And I can't remember exactly what happened, he probably scratched my dad or something like that. And my dad said, I'm gonna kill that cat. And I grabbed the cat and crawled under the bed with him to this cat that wouldn't let my dad near him, I don't think he would let very many people near him, I was able to grab him go into the bed and I wouldn't come out and out from under the bed until my mom made my dad promise that nothing would happen to the cat. And I have been a cat person ever since we had dogs growing up. But I have always gravitated toward cats. I've always loved them. I've always had cats. And I will probably always have cats.

Collin 06:15

Well, so I think we should should say here is that your business is Cat care, specifically, is only its exclusively. So why when you were when you left your corporate job in 2003. And you made that jump? Why was it that you were going to do cat care only as opposed to other animals.

Shelly R. 06:34

I'm really a cat person. I like dogs. They're nice, but I don't want to be out walking, I don't want to have that I don't like going to the same place every single day. That's one nice thing about cats. It's always changing. Because it's basically when people are traveling for business or pleasure. And I kind of looked at it as if I was going to do dogs and that was going to be nine to five Monday through Friday, I might as well stay in a corporate job and have benefits. So I have been Yeah, I was cat only from the very beginning. We always stay cat only we take care of a couple fish here and there. We've taken care of a guinea pig or rabbit. But yeah, we're and everybody who works for me as a real cat person. I have one employee who has a dog, everybody else. She has two cats as well. But everybody else is hardcore cat person.

Collin 07:17

So what does that what does that mean? And what do you look for an employee when you're going to hire them to know that they are a hardcore cat person,

Shelly R. 07:25

they'll tell you that they'll give you that information without you even asking because they lie down when they talk about cats. And they talk about cat state hat. And they talked about I've several employees who live in places where they're not allowed to have pets. So they get their cat fixed this way. They understand that cats aren't one size fits all that every cat is not going to like them, which is a biggie. I think for people who don't understand cats, and they think they're more like dogs we get a lot of I don't hear this from my employees. But I hear it from people who don't understand cats. They they hear about what I do. And they are just astounded. And they say, well, cats are independent, can't just put down a bowl of food and you know, somewhere for him to go to the bathroom and leave him. And I always looked at him I say I'm independent. I don't want to be alone 24/7. And cats don't either. I think even the ones who aren't super social, they still like to know that they're not completely alone.

Collin 08:17

There are a lot of misconceptions around cats and cat care. And I think even for us, you know, we've had some clients who, who the client, their cat owner, maybe a new cat owner, or maybe they just believe some of these myths about cats who say, Oh, just come every other day or you know, you don't have to do this. You don't have to do that. And it's like, no, no, like, we're gonna, we're gonna do all the things for your cat while you're gone. Like that's just part of what we do.

Shelly R. 08:41

Yeah, we get people who say you don't have to scoop the litter box every day. It's like, yes, we do. You don't have to do this every day. Yes, we're going to you may not do that. But we're going to do it every day. And it's easier. It's just easier to have that routine. Yeah. Because if you know, oh, I only scoop the litter box every other day, then one time you're going to forget it. And it's going to become a problem. It's just easier to have a routine we do. We tell people we do food, water litter and any medication as soon as we walk in the door. And then all the time after that is spent doing whatever makes your cat happy, whether it's playing whether it's petting, whether I've got one who just wants to sit in each row and have me scratch his head. Some you know, they just want to know somebody there I have some that hide under bed and I'll sit on the floor. And I'll read a book or you know, listen to a podcast. And eventually they come out and the nice thing about those is when you win them over, you are in for good. Like they don't it's not like the next time you go and you have to start over once they trust you they you're in

Collin 09:38

Yeah, it's one of the best feelings in the world. Whenever you have that cat who hasn't seen you haven't seen you know the whole time and you know, and then all of a sudden it pokes its head out. It's interested in interacting, you're just like, Yes, this is this is a good day.

Shelly R. 09:52

After that, it looks to you like what I've always been coming out what are you

Collin 09:58

thinking back to 2018 Three whenever you decided it was time to make that jump for you, and what was it that finally got you out into going out on your own? You know, you had mentioned that there were some things they were worried about, about having a job about the severance and whether that was going to come through and all this stuff. What do you think it was at that finally made you go out on your own, and some laid some of those early foundations for you?

Shelly R. 10:21

I was so tired of working in an office because I always had jobs where you had somebody had to be there, they were always in some sort of support. Like I was doing email, server maintenance and support was last thing I did at the Fed. And somebody had to be there, even if there was nothing being done. And I just thought about all the other things I could be doing with my time. And I really liked that sitting, I was helping my pet sitter, I was really enjoying it. So when I had the opportunity, I thought, Oh, well, I've got this great severance package. So I can do this while I figure out what I really want to do. And yeah, you see where that caught me. 18 years later, everybody says, Did you have a plan? I'm like, I thought I'd take care of cats for a year while I figured out what I wanted to do. sort of evolved from there, just and it happened really naturally. I met a vet shortly. It was after I started. Pet Sitting I met a vet. And I was talking to her and I had an interaction with my first really fractious cat I had never like I was one of these people who thought all cats are sweet. They all love me, bla bla bla. And yeah, this cat was diabetic. And it hated me. It actually hated everybody except for its people. And that was such a big, just unexpected experience for me, I met a vet out on a photography workshop. And I told her about this. And she said, Well, why don't you come into my practice? And I'll teach you how to deal with the cats who are fractious, the ones who don't want you handling them. So I volunteered out there for about six months. And it really made a huge difference. Wow. Yeah, I already had a lot of medical experience, because I had two cats with kidney failure. One of them was also hyperthyroid them, one of them had cancer. So I was adept at fluids and all that jazz. But I've never been with, like the cat that really would do some damage. And of course, I'm trying to give this diabetic cat insulin and he's trying to tear me up. So being able to volunteer it of that was really good, I don't think you could do that. Now, I don't think they would let somebody come in and just volunteer. So I was really fortunate with that,

Collin 12:24

well, so if someone's listening to this, and they have a client who's has a cat that maybe doesn't really like them, and they need to interact with it, what are some places for them to start and start getting better at that process,

Shelly R. 12:36

if they know anybody who like if they know a vet tech that they're friends with, that they can work with, if they can have show them some tips and tricks for doing this. Getting a towel, like if you have to do a diabetic cat, and they're really not having any of it or a sub q, if you can get a towel over the cat, you can usually settle it down a little and then you can hold them down and flip the towel over your hand so you can get to the back of their neck. But I'm really fortunate for me now that I've got staff I can send somebody in because sometimes it's not that the cat is fractious, it's that I'm not the right person for the cat. And I don't take that personally, it's like I know, cats are not one size fits all, they don't love everybody. So I've got somewhere, you know, all go in, and they, they act one way I send an employee in and then they're all over the employee. So it really comes from just experience and confidence you have to they you know, cats pick up on your energy. So if you're nervous doing this with them, they're going to pick up on it and they're going to use it to their advantage.

Collin 13:36

Yeah, I will say the whole energy aspect is really huge. And I feel like it's even more so with cats than it is even with dogs and if you come into the house hyped up or you know, stressed out based off of things that have just happened to you, you know, you hit that red light that you always hit and, you know, if you're running a few minutes behind, that can really really set yourself up for, for really not a good visit with with some cats, because they are really sensitive to that.

Shelly R. 14:04

Or if you come in, and you have to do medication and you're expecting it to be a problem. They pick up on that immediately. I mean, we have a we've had more than one client who will pay us to come in and sub q their cat because their cat works then their cat knows that if they act like they're, you know, it's horrible and the person is hurting them that they're going to stop because it's their person. And I'll go in and I just picked the cat up and stick the needle in and we're done and they just look at me like I'm a miracle worker and I tell him it's because the cat doesn't have an emotional connection with me it knows that I'm you know this is going to happen and it doesn't. The things that it does with you to make you stop doing this are not going to work with me

Collin 14:43

reminds me a lot of my children and how they know how to pit each other, you know, one against the other and parents and grandparents and all sorts of stuff and remembering that you know they the the animals are going to pick up on your behavior intentions and your energy to and to make sure you're coming in knowing What's gonna happen?

Shelly R. 15:01

Don't go in expecting failure because that's pretty much a recipe for disaster.

15:09

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Doug 15:13

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Collin 15:33

new petsitting software, give time to pet a try, listeners of our show can save 50% off your first three months by visiting time to pet.com forward slash confessions. One of your core values is to know that you are making a difference. How do you see your your company tales of the kitty as making a difference, we allow

Shelly R. 15:56

all these people to do what they need to do in life and feel confident that their pet is being taken care of. And you know, the animal a lot of times these people don't have kids. So this is the the animal that means the most to them. And the fact that they trust us and they allow us to care for their pets, it's just it's a win win.

Collin 16:15

I think it's recognizing that when we are impacting the pets life we're actually doing is impacting the client's life, it's this kind of work around to be able to let them have experiences to go do things and not feel either guilty or burdened or bad about leaving their cat. They're there. They're a member of their family, in the care of somebody else, like we kind of are in the business of giving the peace of mind to clients, yeah, as much as we are as caring for their pets. When

Shelly R. 16:45

I tell clients, I'm like you need, you need to listen to your gut. In this situation, you really need to listen to your gut, when you're hiring somebody to take care of your cat, you know, you need to do your due diligence with all the more official kind of things like reputation and reviews and recommendations, but also listen to your gut because this person's going to be in your home, taking care of your family member. And if you don't feel good about it, then you need to find somebody else. And I don't have you know, if I'm not the right business for you, then I'm happy to recommend other people. It that trust factor

Collin 17:15

is huge. And you know, we are coming in as strangers trying to convince people basically let us care for your family member for you and your staff. How do you build that trust before you even walk through the door? And What's that process like for kind of getting clients on your side?

Shelly R. 17:33

Lots and lots of communication. I'm big on communication, all of my employees can communicate directly with the people that they're caring for their pets, there's none of this, it has to go through me. So we're always it's relationship building all the time, I'm always telling my employees, you know, you need to make sure you take care of the client, because the cat can't tell the client, how good of a job you're doing. Yes, the client comes home, they see that their pets happy. But you need to be communicating with them, you know, sending them pictures, telling them what you're doing with the cat. Because that's all they have to go on. I mean, now they have cameras. So there's a lot more to go on. You know, we tell our people behave as if your eyes being watched, because chances are you are and treat them like you would want your cat treated. Treat the clients the way you want to be treated. Treat the pets the way you would want your pet to be treated.

Collin 18:22

It absolutely does. And I think hiring hardcore cat people to care for the pets of hardcore cat people really helps you understand some motivations and expectations a lot better as well. Whenever you have kind of all these people on the same, you really do become part of the team of the we all have the same goals here. The client has the same goals, we have the same goal of excellent pet care and happy cat at the end of this.

Shelly R. 18:44

It was really interesting, because during the shutdown, you know, our business really tanked. And we we didn't have a day with no visits, fortunately. But we had days where you know, there were one or two. And it was really wonderful to talk to my employees as the shutdown went on. And they would talk about specific cats that they missed. Because I'm I'm always wondering, you know, are they getting tired of this because my Pete, I have people who've been with me over 10 years. It's like people don't really leave when they start this if they leave it's because they're moving away, or they're going to school. It's usually something big. It's not just oh, I found a different job. And it was just really wonderful to hear. You know, I really miss so and so I wonder how they're doing. So we had, like we sent postcards to all the cats during the shutdown. And then we sent a light at the end of the tunnel postcard and we dressed him to the cat and we go into clients houses and we see him on the refrigerators and it's just it's really nice. I really love. I'm a people person. And I didn't realize when I started this job, how or this business, how isolating it can be I didn't think about the fact that you were not around people anymore. So building these relationships with clients is really rewarding for me.

Collin 19:54

I think it's rewarding for a lot more people that are probably willing to admit that the relationship with relations kinships with the clients is one of the best things that we get to do and we get to be involved in when they care about our business. And we care about their success as a pet parent, it really does end up going both ways. And we want to see each other successful and have those connections with everybody, because that does lead to more trust more more things. And as that grows, but foundationally, as you said, it's about communication and being honest and being upfront with people.

Shelly R. 20:28

It really another thing that came out of the shutdown is I really learned just how much our clients do value us because you know, you think they do, but you don't get a lot of feedback from that. And I ran a go fund me because I was really worried about my people. And it's like, if I don't take care of my people, I'm not gonna have a business at the other end of this. So I ran a Go Fund Me and I don't have any problem asking people for money. If it's not for me, I can't ask for myself, but I am really good at fundraising for all sorts of other things. And our clients really, really stepped up they donated. It's on GoFundMe, so you can see it, it's about $70,000 That got us through the shutdown. Wow. Yeah, it was, it was it was really something I cried more than once.

Collin 21:16

Well, yeah, you can't you can't help but not to, to know that you're pouring in all this passion all this time, all this energy, all this effort, all this of you, and you know of your staff, as well. They're giving 100% And, you know, you don't see it every day, and then all of a sudden to see it just be returned, you know, tenfold or more to you. Because it was a big step right to step out and ask me like, Hey, I know this is tough. And I know it's tough for everybody. You know, this is something that really helped us to see clients step up and say that, and I'm sure a lot of people did that, who maybe never had said anything before. And to know the literally coming out of the woodwork.

Shelly R. 21:52

They were so generous. It was just it's still it's still just floors me. I'm still I'm I haven't had time yet. But I want to write a personal thank you to every single person who done it. I mean, we did a thank you card. The employees we have Thank you postcards made so they wrote a thank you to if they were the primary sitter, they send a thank you postcard to every client. And then I sent emails as they came in, I emailed everyone and thank them, but I really want to do a handwritten personal card to everybody who donated I think it's important. I think that's another, you know, it's another connection you build.

Collin 22:25

Because again, we're talking about actual relationships here. Sure. It's, it's a it's a business transaction a lot of the time, but it's based on this fundamental trust that's only there because of this relationship that you have with somebody and to you know, it's it's kind of easy for it to get put off to the side or taken for granted sometimes until these moments of need or these moments of true generosity come through. We're really it does make such a big impact.

Shelly R. 22:49

Yeah, it was really eye opening was really an amazing experience.

Collin 22:53

You are in San Francisco, as you've mentioned a couple times, and you're a cat only business. So what is the market like for cat care in San Francisco these

Shelly R. 23:03

days? There are six cat only businesses that I know of. There are it's a thriving industry here because people, a lot of buildings don't allow dogs so people get cats. Most of the people here well, I shouldn't say most but a huge percentage of the residents of San Francisco live in apartments or condos. So a cat is more practical than a dog. So it's I remember when I first started, I was so worried about, you know, being competitive. And it's just like there is plenty of business to go around here. And there's there's a business for everybody. Because it's not like we all run the same way. So if we you know, if we're not the right fit for somebody, I've generally got somebody I can refer them to one of my employees started her own business. She had started it before the shutdown, covering areas of the city we didn't cover and then during the shutdown, she focused on that. So by the time things reopened, she was up and going and I'm I'm thrilled for her. I mean, she does a great job. So I'm really glad it's working out for her.

Collin 24:01

So what was it like supporting your staff member as they went out on their own? Because I think that's kind of a, I think it's a common fear of many people who have staff members of oh, they're going to leave and they're going to start their own business. It sounds like you were super excited and supportive of this. So what was that process?

Shelly R. 24:15

Well, I got super excited and supportive after I've been doing this for a long time and realize that my employees are not going to steal clients. They like having a day off. They like knowing that they have sick pay. They like knowing that if they don't, you know, they want to take a trip that all makes sure their visits are covered. They like all that. And they're not going to steal one client. If they know they're going to lose their job. And their job is where they're primarily, you know, it's just not worth it. But she, you know, she lived outside of our service area. And she started we actually started we would get messages from people who wanted service and they were outside of our service area. And I would say do you want this person because she had mentioned she wanted to start her own business and she was she also came from a business background she had insurance before she started doing anything, she had a website. And so it was really great to watch that grow. It was really, you know, the day she wrote me and said, I got my website up, well, you take a look at it. And it was, it was really rewarding. And it's nice to see her so successful. Because I do I know she does a good job. So it's really great to have another person that I can refer to who I know is going to do a great job. And I can tell people, when I refer to her unlike she used to work for me, I know she's great, she'll do a good job with your cat.

Collin 25:30

I love that attitude to know that you are part of the forming and foundations of this person who's going out on their own now. So you can without question referred people to her if they need me like that is very comforting as a business because we're constantly going, Oh, I don't know who to refer to, or I don't have anybody I can recommend and to be like, well, I basically trained this person and really helped them get off the ground. So use them.

Shelly R. 25:56

Yes, it's really great. Yeah, I know, I just, I was one of those people who was really worried when I started that, you know, you don't want to talk to other pet sitters. You don't want to do this, because you know, it's all everybody's competition. And I've totally done a 180 from that. Like, we're all do, you know, we're all trying, we all want everybody to be successful.

Collin 26:15

We do we want we want everybody to be successful, we want to see the best pet care providers in the game, continuing to provide the best possible pet care. And that comes from supporting each other giving referrals, you know, reaching out with help or getting together. So I know you said there are are six other companies. Do you guys know that you know of maybe more than that? Okay. Do you find yourself working together in in collaborating much?

Shelly R. 26:42

Oh, yeah, we've gotten together. I mean, we haven't done it since the shutdown. And since things started reopening, but we have met up and talks about things. And I've met one of the women, she bought two cat care businesses and combine them into one, but well, so we have spent a lot of time talking. And it's been really great talking to her because she came from a business background as well. But she had no cat sitting experience when she bought these businesses. So she looks at things really differently than I do. I'm really emotionally invested in my business because I started it. She bought two that were already going rolled into one. So she doesn't have that same emotional connection. So she has really been inspirational for me about a lot of things, a lot of things that I'd like to change. And I thought I couldn't because of this or that no, because just because I was too emotionally invested in it. So she's It's great talking to her. And I'd given her I think I'd like to think some really good information about the just the petsitting side of things and why I do things the way I do.

Collin 27:43

You said a key phrase there that I about you are very emotional about the business because it's your business. And the majority of people are like you are they we founded our businesses, we are the people who did a lot of stuff at the very beginning. How do you find separating out those emotions from the business and making just business

Shelly R. 28:06

decisions? It's, it's easier, it's getting easier, I shouldn't say it's easier now. Because it's been a long process. And I'm one of those people, I have to really hit the wall of fun before I'm willing to make a change. Like I have to just be at the end of my rope and be like, if I don't make a change, I'm going to lose my mind. And it can't be Oh, I'm tired of doing this because it took me three years of talking about not wanting to do evening visits anymore before I finally handed them off to somebody. And for me, it's a lot of needing to be willing to delegate. And I've got two managers now who are both sitters. And they've kind of come up through the ranks Nicole, I couldn't do any of this without her. She was one of my she was a client who said to me, if you ever need help, let me know. And so she helped me for several years. And I kept saying I wish she'd quit your job and come work for you know, I wish to do this with me. And she got laid off. So I scored and she's been with me full time for gosh 13 years now, something like that. 13 or 14. She knows we brought the software on together because she came on and we had to have software because we didn't have any way to share a schedule. And then I've got another sitter who's really proactive and so she manages one part of the service area Nicole manage. There's another part I manage the other and then now that the world has reopened, I knew somebody who used to own a bar and use has managed several bars. So she has a lot of experience managing people and I just brought her on she's not doing any pet setting. She's doing all administrative functions. She did all the she's been doing all the HR work for us which has just been wonderful because you know you don't have time to screen all these applicants because you're out working. So she does all that for me and she's how I've been able to hire since the world reopened and she is just every day. I feel a little bit better about handing stuff off to her so I am moving a lot of things that I owe thought I would do forever, I'm finally starting to be willing to hand a lot of those off. And I'm, I trust my people, I trust my people, even my employees to make good business decisions. And so most of the time, they'll check with me. And it's like, yeah, I trust you, you're making the right decision. So it's a lot of just confirming with them that what they're thinking is the same way that I'd like the business to

Collin 30:23

go. What does that done to to you and your relationship with your business as you've delegated more to people around you? Because I think when people hear that process, they feel like, well, then what am I doing? What am I supposed to do? I'm delegating

Shelly R. 30:39

it to I'd like to travel six months of the year. That's my ultimate goal. And it's interesting, because it used to be I knew every single client stain, you know, they would email in or they would schedule a visit, and I knew exactly who they were. And now there are so many who I their name comes across, if I'm in, you know, if I need to know something, I have to look them up, because I've never met them, but they've met, you know, either one of my two other managers or they know, their sitters. So there's just this, it is like a big family. It's like I can't know everybody, it's gotten to the size that I can't have my finger and everything. And I mean, it's taken me a long time to be willing to hand any of that off, probably been the last five years when I really started being willing to give up things and it's still a really slow process. Like right now I'm thinking maybe I'll start having my bookkeeper do payroll, and I've had it for, you know, 10 years now. And I'm just now starting to think well, maybe she could do payroll instead of me doing it.

Collin 31:37

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Shelly R. 32:48

I still think of it as a little bit. Me It's not a little business when people are surprised, because, you know, I'll meet somebody and we're talking and they'll say something they'll say you have employees? I'm like, well, in California, it was an optional, you know, I couldn't have independent contractors. i It was employees. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, some of them only do you know, they only do two visits a day. And then I have four who are this is all they do. So it varies, you know the volume that people are doing varies. And that's another thing that people they still think of this kind of as a nine to five job. And you have to explain to them that you know, it varies day to day, some days are busy, some aren't. But there's nothing dependable like when we're interviewing, we tell people, there's nothing dependable and reliable about this other than you will work weekends and holidays will be crazy. That's all you can 100% count on. So as long as they're good was flexible. And you know, a flexible schedule where you make your own schedule, for the most part really appeals to certain people. And those are the people that I have to find because it's not like the only restrictions we have our you know, if it's a morning visit, it has to happen between these times, if it's medical, you have to be here in this time range. But if it's just a daily visit, we just say try to keep it you know, within a two or three hour window every day. So you're there around the same time, but do it when it works for you. And so once you find that people who appreciate that sort of workstyle they don't leave, if you treat them, right, they don't leave and I try to treat all my employees the way I wanted to be treated when I worked for somebody.

Collin 34:21

So what does that what does that mean to you treating them like you want to be treated for you that seems to have worked out? Amazing, given that you have some staff they've been with you for you know, 13 years, 10 years and so on. How do you as a manager in implementing all this stuff, make sure that you're you are doing that and you're consistent with your employees. Part of

Shelly R. 34:41

it is letting them make decisions and trusting their judgment. That's a big part of it. I mean, they still run things by me, but they pretty much know that I'm going to say yes, they know how we operate. They know that I'm okay with them communicating with clients. Some of them have built really close relationship with And let me tell you, that's reflected in their tips, I've got people to get some ridiculous tips. And it's because of the way they communicate with clients. So when I tell that to my other employees, I'm like, you know, if you want to get really good tips, you need to make sure you're communicating with the client. I took really good care of them during the shutdown, we've always done we have get togethers for a while before the shutdown, we were meeting up an employee every other month got to pick a restaurant, we would all go as a group, if you can make it, you made it if you didn't, you know, it was no big deal. So I just, you know, I try to give them quite know what the word is autonomy. Within the business, I trust them, we do when they're first starting out, we go in and we check up on you know, we go in after they do a last visit, make sure everything was okay, that sort of thing. But once they're up and going, it's pretty rare that we have to follow up on things

Collin 35:56

trusting that the processes that you use to bring them into the company worked well enough that you have confidence in this person to go down, go out and do the job that you hired them to

Shelly R. 36:06

do. When you also have to figure out what's motivating people, I've got some people who want to, you know, appreciation is a big thing for them. That's a big thing. For me, it's like money's great, but if I know you appreciate me, I'll bend over backwards for you. So I have employees who are like that I have other employees who are totally driven by money, they love the cats, but they're the money is their motivator. So you need to understand what motivates them and then kind of work with them like the you know, the ones who like to be appreciated, I'm always telling them how much I appreciate them. The ones who are motivated by money, I let them do as many visits as they want. If they tell me they want to do 14 visits in a day, I'll let them do 14 visits in a day, as long as they can get it done in a manageable amount of time.

Collin 36:48

What's that process like for you getting to know your your staff, being nervous everyone so that you can pick up on these kinds of things for them. Because I know, for me, I would be doing my best to try and manage them, and then also being like, Oh, now I've got to get to know them personally, and get to know what their likes. And this is an awful lot.

Shelly R. 37:07

Honestly, we hang out a lot together. A lot of us do. And one of my employees also manages the apartment building I live in, I see him all the time. I have a club I hang out at all the time. So funnily enough, it's called Cat club, but it's an 80s dance club. And a lot of Nick will come there. And hey, you know, we spend the night hanging out together, I've hired a lot of people who are friends of existing employees, or they've come through a reference from a client. Or I've hired a couple people who used to be clients, a couple of them I don't know, as well. But they know the person who manages the area they're covering, but they all know that they can reach out to me, they can text me, they can call me, they can email me whatever. And I'm gonna I have a special tone on my phone. That's all it's an old ministry song work for love. So when one of them contacts me, my phone just goes work, work or work. So it's easy to know, it's them, and I just grabbed the phone. So we just try to be there for him. I guess it's probably the biggest and I just try to treat him the way I want to be treated. I try you know, if they tell me I don't want to do you name business anymore. I try to make sure they don't have to do evening visits. I don't just randomly assign things to people because they're available. I do. That's one thing I do, I do. Not a lot. But if it's a client that they don't normally see, or it's a time of the visit that they don't normally do, I want to stick it on their schedule on message them to make sure that they're okay with doing it. I think that goes a long way to building their willingness to help out in situations like that.

Collin 38:38

Yeah, again, you use that really good word earlier of autonomy, treating them as an individual, as a person with agency that you rely on as a business, right, giving them just basically inherent value as a staff member and recognizing that the amount of help and support that they're bringing, and that that's just part of recognition in treating them like a human being at that point. And and sometimes just as simple, as you said, just asking, Is this okay? If we do this, and letting them know that you really do value, their their opinion and what their input

Shelly R. 39:09

is? Well, I'm always telling all of them that, yeah, I started the business, but you are the reason the business is successful. This business would not be where it is, if it were just me, the only reason it's where it is, is because of all of them. And it's really important to me that they they know that and they know that it's the truth.

Collin 39:28

You work hard to build relationships with your clients. And it sounds like you that you work really hard to maintain real life relationships with your staff and make sure that they feel accepted and known. Does that ever weigh on you being getting stressed out about knowing that you have these employees that really depend on the success of the business for their livelihood, too?

Shelly R. 39:50

It does to an extent that they all come in knowing that this isn't a an industry, at least with the cat only thing where you are going to ever have dependable real variable income, but I do like when they're first starting, I do kind of remind them that like, yeah, January slow, but things will pick up and I kind of smooth it'll we try to smooth it along until they get into the groove because it takes a little while to really get a feel for what this is like, and how it does vary so much from day to day. But then yeah, once they're, once they have it, and they see that it's going to be consistent, isn't the right word to use, because it's not consistent, but it's going to be consistent inconsistency. Easier for them, they just get a feel for it, and it becomes manageable. And they learn to take advantage of the slow times like they they learn that you know, January, February, or it's going to be slow. So work as much as you can at Christmas, because it'll carry you through. I do things like on for the holidays, they there's a $10 holiday fee on every visit that the whole thing goes to them on Christmas Day, I pay them all double their regular rate plus they get the $10. So everybody wants to work, Christmas and Thanksgiving. So I just try to do as much as I can for them, and still keep the business afloat.

Collin 41:06

Yeah, I think you're walking that line between making sure that the people who your business is built with your staff and the people who really, as you said, make the business what it is, while still knowing that, you know, it's still a business to run at the end of the day. Yeah. And it's it is the it is this fine line to balance.

Shelly R. 41:24

And I've always I've always believed, for me, relationships are the most important thing in life. So whether that's with my employees, with my clients, with my friends, it's like that's what really matters. It's not how much stuff I have. It's the relationships I don't you know, they're everything to me,

Collin 41:40

thinking back over the last 18 years of business, you know, you've been serving San Francisco for that entire time. How has the pet industry changed, or I guess more specifically, how have client expectations changed over that course of time,

Shelly R. 41:56

when I started, I had to get a cell phone, I didn't even have a cell phone. I didn't have a website for the first couple years. And now you know, we're in such a tech center. It's like, if you don't have a website, you can't do anything. Yelp is I know a lot of people hate Yelp. Yelp is wonderful for us. It's we get a lot of clients from Yelp, we get a lot of clients from next door we a huge number of clients from client recommendations. Back when I started, we would send an everything was email, we would send an email on the first visit, we would leave a note card on the final visit. Now we message every visit, not just every day, but every visit they want, you know people want an update, it's just gotten to the point where even if they tell us, they don't want an update, we just go ahead and send it. We didn't have software, when we started, I was using a palm pilot. I had you know a sheet that I went and filled out now clients fill out their own profile. And you know, I wasn't taking credit cards back then it was all cash or cheque. And now it's you know, pretty much all credit cards, it's just most I think the biggest changes are the tech changes. You know, there are cameras now there weren't cameras, but, you know, the way I did visits then is the same way I do. Um, now. Now we've got, you know, codes on doors and a lot more alarms, just that sort of thing. But the basic, what we're doing hasn't really changed. And I

Collin 43:14

think that's important to note is that it's not anything that's just radically different than its maybe some of the operational things, but at its core, the care of the cats is still what it was. And it's carrying that and will and will continue to be forevermore because because that's just at the core of what your business is and the expectations you have on yourself and what you would want your cat cared for.

Shelly R. 43:37

Yeah, that's a big, you just take care of the cat's away you want your cat care for hopefully, that's really good care.

Collin 43:42

Yeah. That's true. Yeah, you know, we do a lot of reflection of like, treat your staff as you would want to be treated. Okay, make sure you know how you want to be treated before you start treating your staff that way and, and care for the pets, the way you would want your pets care care for. Make sure you know how you care for your pets before you go out and try and do that because it's easier to communicate and better to, it's easier to connect with the clients as well. Whenever you have those same goals objectives, like we talked about earlier,

Shelly R. 44:11

when clients could tell I mean, still to this day, when I walk into a new client meeting because I go, I still go to a lot of new client meetings. I really like meeting people, it's fun to go and talk to them. But the first thing I do is I'm down on the floor petting the cat. So it's still that's what it's all you know, the clients are great, but you know, I do this because I love cats. And all my employees, you know, they're great, too. They go in and I've got, you know, they'll lay down on the floor with the cat

Collin 44:37

thinking about that client interaction for you. When do you think it is in the process that somebody decides that they're going to go with with your company and go with tales of the kitty? Do you think that most of them went right when they reach out? They know they're already going to go with you or do you think that the deal is sealed during the meet and greet or some or somewhere else?

Shelly R. 44:59

I have always assumed that if they contact us and we set up a new client meeting, it's a done deal. And I think that's a really good attitude to have when you're going in, I don't look at it as I have to sell myself a lot of time, you know, I know they've talked to friends or they've had a recommendation from somebody. So I think just going in believing that it's a done deal changes your attitude, because you're not trying to sell yourself, you're just saying, This is what we do. This is who I am, this is what we're going to provide you. And it's, you know, works well for us.

Collin 45:30

I think I think that you're right, that confidence really does come through whenever you're interacting. I know, in just we I have felt it during meet and greets, and we're getting to know them. When I'm when I'm not confident when I'm think oh, I think this you know, this person asked a couple questions about the price. I don't think they're going to go with us, then I don't show up on my game. I'm not interacting. Well, I'm not conversing with them. But on the ones where people are just like, hey, I need you this Friday, and we schedule them in great. It's like boom, boom, boom, done. Awesome. And and I feel like when we step in, confident in our services, confident in the care we're going to give and our staff that we've hired, that really does speak volumes for ourselves whenever we are interacting with people. Yes, for sure. It really does. Shelly, I have really appreciated our time talking today and discussing your philosophy behind building relationships and how it's the core of everything that you do and encouraging us to support our staff if we have them and to continue to build those relationships in our businesses. You've got a ton of experience and and I've been in the industry for a long time. So I know there's a whole lot more to cover. So if people are interested in getting connected and following along and picking your brain on stuff, how best can they do that?

Shelly R. 46:41

The best way is probably to email me you can email Shelly sh e ll ly at tales of the kitty calm and it's t a l e. S And yes, Armistead mopan. Did Okay, the name when I started the business? Or if it's easier for you to remember, you can email me at Shelly at There she goes again, calm. Okay. One more.

Collin 47:03

Okay. Okay, perfect. Well, I'll have both of those links in the show notes, people can copy those and get in touch with you right away. So tell again, this has been a real pleasure and a real joy. Thank you so much for coming on the show today.

Shelly R. 47:16

I have really enjoyed this, it has been really entertaining and fun. And yeah, anybody just wants to pick my brain reach out, because I am always happy to share whatever information I may have. It may not be applicable to everybody. But if you can learn anything, or use any of it, you're welcome to it.

Collin 47:35

If nobody's ever told you this, I want to do it. Right now. You make a difference in the world, you make a difference every single time you step through the door of somebody's home somebody's apartment, to care for their pet. That pet is that person's world, it means the world to them. And you make a difference by caring for them. You allow people to live their lives and have confidence that their pets are being cared for. They don't have to think through that. Because of the trust that you've built. Because of the communication that you've put in and all the hard work and dedication that you put in every single day that you wake up and you go out and you care for those pets. You might not see it all the time. And a lot of times clients have a hard time exactly communicating how you're helping them how you're helping the pet the difference that you're making in both of their lives. But you are and that's the confidence that you can take forward into meeting greets into expansion ideas into new things in your business, the confidence that comes from knowing that you're helping people knowing that you're helping pets can fuel you and can fuel your business through tough times, can push you to try new things and can help continue to make your business better. We want to thank pet sitters International and time to pet for sponsoring today's episode. We want to thank you for listening. We hope you have a wonderful rest of the week. And we'll be back again soon.